Star Wars Discussion

[webstar1000]

Yeah, Rise of Skywalker takes place less than 30 years after The Mandalorian. Given that Baby Yoda is 50 in the show and looks to be about a year old in our terms, he'd be like at best 1 and a half, so just about the same.

This is something that bothered me, unless I missed something, with TRoS.......

Spoiler:

That there was absolutely no tie in what so ever with The Mandalorian and more to the point, Baby Yoda. The only possible very slight tie-in was the ability to heal, which I don't believe was ever demonstrated by the Jedi in previous films. I may be dead wrong on that one and I'm sure you more devoted fans will correct me if I am I hope.

I don't know about the rest of you guys, but given the close proximity of the timelines in play and the premise for, "The Child" in the Mandalorian, it screams to me that baby Yoda should have at least had an honorable mention in TRoS. Also among the missing were, ethereal, Anakin and Obi-Wan. What they decide to retire to Boca? lol

Also, and I'm just mulling things over, a previous post had the age of BY at approximately 1 yr in human terms. However, it's stated that BY is 50 yrs old in the show and if I recall correctly Yoda was around 800 yrs old when he passed away. That's one helluva range and since we have no basis what so ever as to how "Yoda's" are conceived and age we really have no basis at all to speculate on BY's age in human years at all. Even size could betray any attempt to speculate on BY's age. Also, if you think about it, it seems to me that BY has much more maturity than a 1 yr old human. IDK just ruminating I suppose. lol lol

While searching for something else I came across this..................

https://www.pocket-lint.com/tv/news/...-viewing-order

and thought I'd post it for you guys since there was so much discussion earlier in the thread regarding the order to do a re-watch.

Baby Yoda is the reason Palpatine comes back Bill. That is the reason for the Mandalorian timeline and why they are after this 'child' so bad. They want to resurrect him. I also would have guessed at the end of a few seasons of Mando... Baby Yoda brings him back and dies

Spoiler:

like Ben did saving Rey

BUT now I think since he is SO huge... he won't. Disney will milk this proverbial tit I am sure. haha

Really? i don't know how I managed to miss that tidbit. lol Then again, I had my 7 yr old grandson with me and he got antsy during the non-action scenes.

Spoiler:

Can you explain a little more? Palpatine's boys used BY how? Was there more explanation regarding the Yoda culture/race? They killed BY and used his life force to bring back the Emperor?

A distinct feeling. The timing of the show (after Return of the Jedi) and the healing aspects shown in both. Mark my words!


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[Joe315]

Re the balance discussion, what is the “balance” that anakin was prophesied to bring? If it was the rule of 2 then yeah I guess he did. But if it was about power, I don’t think he did. Palpatine was very strong and joining him certainly didn’t even out any balance of power, IMO, especially after killing all the younglings.

Spoiler

Even with Rey killing palpatine, and as strong as she appears to be, I don’t think the force has become “unbalanced”. Just because he is dead doesn’t mean there isn’t someone using the dark side of the force.

[Lookwhoitis]

Sure, I am one of those fellows who likes everything star wars puts out.

I find your lack of taste disturbing.

And a four-year-old liking or disliking something is a pretty low bar.

Hey man, I saw my 4 year old niece with wonder in her eyes last night so you can take yer crotchety attitude and and stick it where the sun dont shine!

Merry Christmas!

[Mattrick]

Re the balance discussion, what is the “balance” that anakin was prophesied to bring? If it was the rule of 2 then yeah I guess he did. But if it was about power, I don’t think he did. Palpatine was very strong and joining him certainly didn’t even out any balance of power, IMO, especially after killing all the younglings.

Spoiler

Even with Rey killing palpatine, and as strong as she appears to be, I don’t think the force has become “unbalanced”. Just because he is dead doesn’t mean there isn’t someone using the dark side of the force.

Anakin reduced the force to 2 Jedi and 2 Sith. Balance.

[Joe315]

Re the balance discussion, what is the “balance” that anakin was prophesied to bring? If it was the rule of 2 then yeah I guess he did. But if it was about power, I don’t think he did. Palpatine was very strong and joining him certainly didn’t even out any balance of power, IMO, especially after killing all the younglings.

Spoiler

Even with Rey killing palpatine, and as strong as she appears to be, I don’t think the force has become “unbalanced”. Just because he is dead doesn’t mean there isn’t someone using the dark side of the force.

Anakin reduced the force to 2 Jedi and 2 Sith. Balance.

Is it that simple though? I guess it could be. Just thought George would have gone a bit deeper then that.

[Kingfan24]

Re the balance discussion, what is the “balance” that anakin was prophesied to bring? If it was the rule of 2 then yeah I guess he did. But if it was about power, I don’t think he did. Palpatine was very strong and joining him certainly didn’t even out any balance of power, IMO, especially after killing all the younglings.

Spoiler

Even with Rey killing palpatine, and as strong as she appears to be, I don’t think the force has become “unbalanced”. Just because he is dead doesn’t mean there isn’t someone using the dark side of the force.

Anakin reduced the force to 2 Jedi and 2 Sith. Balance.

Is it that simple though? I guess it could be. Just thought George would have gone a bit deeper then that.

George Lucas is notorious for making dumbass decisions. He wanted to make a character in a Lucas arts video game named Darth icky or darth insanius. The story is pretty wild.

https://www.gameinformer.com/b/featu...ostPageIndex=2

[Joe315]

Maybe it shouldn’t be that surprising given the changes he made to the original trilogy with his special editions

[Merlin1958]

Re the balance discussion, what is the “balance” that anakin was prophesied to bring? If it was the rule of 2 then yeah I guess he did. But if it was about power, I don’t think he did. Palpatine was very strong and joining him certainly didn’t even out any balance of power, IMO, especially after killing all the younglings.

Spoiler

Even with Rey killing palpatine, and as strong as she appears to be, I don’t think the force has become “unbalanced”. Just because he is dead doesn’t mean there isn’t someone using the dark side of the force.

Anakin reduced the force to 2 Jedi and 2 Sith. Balance.

Is it that simple though? I guess it could be. Just thought George would have gone a bit deeper then that.

George Lucas is notorious for making dumbass decisions. He wanted to make a character in a Lucas arts video game named Darth icky or darth insanius. The story is pretty wild.

https://www.gameinformer.com/b/featu...ostPageIndex=2

Maybe it shouldn’t be that surprising given the changes he made to the original trilogy with his special editions

LOL Yeah, he's a dumbass with your money and like 10-11 zero's after his name on his tax return. LOL You've got to remember they are HIS movies, etc. not yours. You don't like what he does, don't support him. However, as much as everyone bitch's about him they all spend their money. LOL Oh, and SPEND they do!!!! LOL

Personally, I love most of what he produced and say thanks for giving us this franchise.


EDIT: Oh, except for, Mattrick. He's excluded from the above. He doesn't like or support him and most other big money franchises. He'll likely take exception to this statement as well.

[Joe315]

Re the balance discussion, what is the “balance” that anakin was prophesied to bring? If it was the rule of 2 then yeah I guess he did. But if it was about power, I don’t think he did. Palpatine was very strong and joining him certainly didn’t even out any balance of power, IMO, especially after killing all the younglings.

Spoiler

Even with Rey killing palpatine, and as strong as she appears to be, I don’t think the force has become “unbalanced”. Just because he is dead doesn’t mean there isn’t someone using the dark side of the force.

Anakin reduced the force to 2 Jedi and 2 Sith. Balance.

Is it that simple though? I guess it could be. Just thought George would have gone a bit deeper then that.

George Lucas is notorious for making dumbass decisions. He wanted to make a character in a Lucas arts video game named Darth icky or darth insanius. The story is pretty wild.

https://www.gameinformer.com/b/featu...ostPageIndex=2

Maybe it shouldn’t be that surprising given the changes he made to the original trilogy with his special editions

LOL Yeah, he's a dumbass with your money and like 10-11 zero's after his name on his tax return. LOL You've got to remember they are HIS movies, etc. not yours. You don't like what he does, don't support him. However, as much as everyone bitch's about him they all spend their money. LOL Oh, and SPEND they do!!!! LOL

Personally, I love most of what he produced and say thanks for giving us this franchise.


EDIT: Oh, except for, Mattrick. He's excluded from the above. He doesn't like or support him and most other big money franchises. He'll likely take exception to this statement as well.

For what it’s worth I’m not bashing Star Wars, I’m bashing Lucas. I get wanting to update some of the visuals to match his vision but there was no need to make it so Han didn’t shoot Greedo first or add the No! scream from Vader in Jedi or change the Max Rebo band in jabbas layer. He got way into the weeds with his changes.

[Merlin1958]

Re the balance discussion, what is the “balance” that anakin was prophesied to bring? If it was the rule of 2 then yeah I guess he did. But if it was about power, I don’t think he did. Palpatine was very strong and joining him certainly didn’t even out any balance of power, IMO, especially after killing all the younglings.

Spoiler

Even with Rey killing palpatine, and as strong as she appears to be, I don’t think the force has become “unbalanced”. Just because he is dead doesn’t mean there isn’t someone using the dark side of the force.

Anakin reduced the force to 2 Jedi and 2 Sith. Balance.

Is it that simple though? I guess it could be. Just thought George would have gone a bit deeper then that.

George Lucas is notorious for making dumbass decisions. He wanted to make a character in a Lucas arts video game named Darth icky or darth insanius. The story is pretty wild.

https://www.gameinformer.com/b/featu...ostPageIndex=2

Re the balance discussion, what is the “balance” that anakin was prophesied to bring? If it was the rule of 2 then yeah I guess he did. But if it was about power, I don’t think he did. Palpatine was very strong and joining him certainly didn’t even out any balance of power, IMO, especially after killing all the younglings.

Spoiler

Even with Rey killing palpatine, and as strong as she appears to be, I don’t think the force has become “unbalanced”. Just because he is dead doesn’t mean there isn’t someone using the dark side of the force.

Anakin reduced the force to 2 Jedi and 2 Sith. Balance.

Is it that simple though? I guess it could be. Just thought George would have gone a bit deeper then that.

George Lucas is notorious for making dumbass decisions. He wanted to make a character in a Lucas arts video game named Darth icky or darth insanius. The story is pretty wild.

https://www.gameinformer.com/b/featu...ostPageIndex=2

Maybe it shouldn’t be that surprising given the changes he made to the original trilogy with his special editions

LOL Yeah, he's a dumbass with your money and like 10-11 zero's after his name on his tax return. LOL You've got to remember they are HIS movies, etc. not yours. You don't like what he does, don't support him. However, as much as everyone bitch's about him they all spend their money. LOL Oh, and SPEND they do!!!! LOL

Personally, I love most of what he produced and say thanks for giving us this franchise.


EDIT: Oh, except for, Mattrick. He's excluded from the above. He doesn't like or support him and most other big money franchises. He'll likely take exception to this statement as well.

For what it’s worth I’m not bashing Star Wars, I’m bashing Lucas. I get wanting to update some of the visuals to match his vision but there was no need to make it so Han didn’t shoot Greedo first or add the No! scream from Vader in Jedi or change the Max Rebo band in jabbas layer. He got way into the weeds with his changes.

Well, I hear what you're saying, but Lucas created Star Wars so the two are quite entwined. As far as the changes go, they fit his vision of the story. And it was his story to tell and he has the right to tell it as he see's it. You either agree or don't I suppose. That is up to you, but it is what it is and no amount of, bashing or griping is going to change that well, except possibly for, Disney!!! lol Now it's THEIR story. lol

[Mattrick]

Re the balance discussion, what is the “balance” that anakin was prophesied to bring? If it was the rule of 2 then yeah I guess he did. But if it was about power, I don’t think he did. Palpatine was very strong and joining him certainly didn’t even out any balance of power, IMO, especially after killing all the younglings.

Spoiler

Even with Rey killing palpatine, and as strong as she appears to be, I don’t think the force has become “unbalanced”. Just because he is dead doesn’t mean there isn’t someone using the dark side of the force.

Anakin reduced the force to 2 Jedi and 2 Sith. Balance.

Is it that simple though? I guess it could be. Just thought George would have gone a bit deeper then that.

It could be deeper in that Luke was the chosen one. Anakin reduced the Jedi down to two, but then Luke was the only one left standing at the end of Jedi (I'm not including Episode 9 retroactive survival of Palpatine here, since Lucas didn't envision that). Luke was not technically a Jedi, not like the old Jedi whom, as the prequels tell us, received extremely extensive training, but he was a Jedi in idea (he was more of an actual Jedi before Lucas changed the definition of what a Jedi is with the prequels). If Luke being the last with no true Jedi or Sith, then the force would be balanced. You cold even argue Luke threw the force out of balance by attempting to revive the Jedi...but then they had to bring The Emperor Back which throws that whole idea out the window.

EDIT: Oh, except for, Mattrick. He's excluded from the above. He doesn't like or support him and most other big money franchises. He'll likely take exception to this statement as well.

I take exception with you being patently incorrect with a narrow view of who I am. I grew up on Star Wars and Indiana Jones. I like George Lucas quite a lot, actually, even if the prequels were a product of him being allowed to be totally unchecked as a filmmaker. He's a great storyteller when it comes to concepts, but he's not a great script writer or director. He should be a producer and lay out a basic story and let someone else write it, like he did with Lawrence Kasdan with Empire and Jedi.


As for not supporting big money franchises, that is also incorrect. Just because some big money franchises don't interest me at all (Harry Potter, Fast and the Furious, DC comics, Disney Wars, Transformers) doesn't mean I don't support big money franchises I do like. I saw John Wick 2 and 3. I've seen every Mission Impossible movie in theatres. I saw the last two Jurassic Worlds in theatres. I've seen every Toy Story movie in theatres. I saw Incredibles 2. I've seen almost every Bond film in theatres since Goldeneye. I saw every X-Men movie in theatres except for the last two for no reason than I wanted to see other movies more...I even saw X-Men Origins Wolverine...oof. I even saw Joker despite my lack of interest in anything DC Comics since The Dark Knight Rises. I've went to see nearly half the MCU movies since 2014. So the idea that I scoff at big money franchises just because I don't like Star Wars is completely incorrect. Imagine paying to see films you know you will like and not paying for films you know you won't like...what a concept!

[Hunchback Jack]

I deliberately stayed away from this thread, because I didn’t want any episode nine spoilers. Looking back on some of the posts here maybe it’s best that I did . Anyway I saw episode nine tonight, so here I am - although not to talk about episode nine.

Over the last couple of nights I watched episode seven and eight again, just to refresh my memory and see if I had a different take on them on re-watching. Watching the force awakens, I had a blast. Yes, it has a lot in common with episode four, and it’s far from flawless, but it feels like a Star Wars movie. And not just in a superficial way - like there are TIE fighters and the millennium falcon and X-wings and stuff - but the way the characters interacted and the themes of the movie were what made it a fun watch. Characters that I like, having space adventures, but with danger and real stakes.

Episode eight is still a mixed bag for me, but I will say that I think it improved on a rewatch. It’s a very different tone from the first movie of course, and it has problems with tone generally, but I think it has a lot to offer once I got past some of the basic premises of the film that I rejected on the first viewing. The whole Finn and Rose plot is still a waste of time, of course, and the theme of “don’t be a hero just follow orders” is still there, but I was more accepting of the Rey and Luke plot thread this time around. Dare I say it, I think it may have been the strongest part of those two movies for me.

In fact, I think these two movies work better as a standalone start of a trilogy, then as a continuation of episodes four five and six. If we didn’t have preconceptions about what Luke should be like, The last Jedi works much better. If the empire wasn’t defeated at the end of return of the Jedi, then you don’t need to explain where the first order or Snoke came from. If the previous films didn’t exist, then our expectations about who Rey’s parents might’ve been don’t exist, and so the whole reveal – or non-reveal - of who they are in the last Jedi isn’t such a letdown. Having the old characters there I think does a disservice to the new trilogy, because it raises questions about how the new characters fit in, and how we got here from the old movies. The new movies work much better when they don’t have all that baggage to carry.

As for the whole issue of Rey being a Mary Sue, I can see what people mean, but honestly it doesn’t bother me at all. I like the character. I’d like that she’s trying to figure out who she is, when she has no parents or memory of parents to draw from. I’m willing to forgive her seemingly miraculous Powers, because she still struggles, and I care enough about her to want her to succeed. That to me is what makes a good movie – that I’m invested in the characters.

[Hunchback Jack]

Re the balance discussion, what is the “balance” that anakin was prophesied to bring? If it was the rule of 2 then yeah I guess he did. But if it was about power, I don’t think he did. Palpatine was very strong and joining him certainly didn’t even out any balance of power, IMO, especially after killing all the younglings.

Spoiler

Even with Rey killing palpatine, and as strong as she appears to be, I don’t think the force has become “unbalanced”. Just because he is dead doesn’t mean there isn’t someone using the dark side of the force.

Anakin reduced the force to 2 Jedi and 2 Sith. Balance.

I believe Lucas has specifically stated that that isn’t what “bringing balance to the force” means. I’ll try to find a reference for that.

If the two Sith are ruling over the galaxy by force and oppression, and the two Jedi are hiding on remote planets in secret, that’s hardly balance. I believe what Lucas intended was that balance of the force was achieved through Luke. Luke balances the Dark side of the force through his Vader heritage, but turned to the light side to become a Jedi. Vader achieved that by both fathering Luke, but also killing the Emperor and saving Luke.

[Merlin1958]

Re the balance discussion, what is the “balance” that anakin was prophesied to bring? If it was the rule of 2 then yeah I guess he did. But if it was about power, I don’t think he did. Palpatine was very strong and joining him certainly didn’t even out any balance of power, IMO, especially after killing all the younglings.

Spoiler

Even with Rey killing palpatine, and as strong as she appears to be, I don’t think the force has become “unbalanced”. Just because he is dead doesn’t mean there isn’t someone using the dark side of the force.

Anakin reduced the force to 2 Jedi and 2 Sith. Balance.

Is it that simple though? I guess it could be. Just thought George would have gone a bit deeper then that.

George Lucas is notorious for making dumbass decisions. He wanted to make a character in a Lucas arts video game named Darth icky or darth insanius. The story is pretty wild.

https://www.gameinformer.com/b/featu...ostPageIndex=2

Re the balance discussion, what is the “balance” that anakin was prophesied to bring? If it was the rule of 2 then yeah I guess he did. But if it was about power, I don’t think he did. Palpatine was very strong and joining him certainly didn’t even out any balance of power, IMO, especially after killing all the younglings.

Spoiler

Even with Rey killing palpatine, and as strong as she appears to be, I don’t think the force has become “unbalanced”. Just because he is dead doesn’t mean there isn’t someone using the dark side of the force.

Anakin reduced the force to 2 Jedi and 2 Sith. Balance.

I believe Lucas has specifically stated that that isn’t what “bringing balance to the force” means. I’ll try to find a reference for that.

If the two Sith are ruling over the galaxy by force and oppression, and the two Jedi are hiding on remote planets in secret, that’s hardly balance. I believe what Lucas intended was that balance of the force was achieved through Luke. Luke balances the Dark side of the force through his Vader heritage, but turned to the light side to become a Jedi. Vader achieved that by both fathering Luke, but also killing the Emperor and saving Luke.

You know, your post made me think of an older show that demonstrated a similar theory/belief called "Carnivale". I don't remember the entire mythology but it dealt with a "Creature of Light" and a "Creature of Darkness" being born into every generation. It was apretty good show that got canned early by HBO despite quite a grass roots campaign.Anyway, it reminds me a lot of what you are referring to in the Sith/Jedi dichotomy and "balance to the Force". At it's core it comes down to in order for there to be balance there must be a light and a dark, good and evil, etc.

[DanHocker]

While I get those explanations I tend to be of the belief that there was never "balance" in the force in the movies. For me at least there has to be Jedi and Sith on equal footing so to speak for there to be "balance". But maybe "balance" isn't what the universe needs. For "good" to prevail, the force needs to be un-balanced. It's kinda like Lucas didn't really think the whole "Chosen One" thing through... How he was creating an idea of "Ying and Yang" but not really executing that idea in a way that made sense. At the end of the day though, it's Star Wars, it's big, it's dumb, and it's full of contradictions and revisionist history (so to speak). As far as the movies go, it's really not all that deep.

[Kingfan24]

https://bleedingfool.com/blogs/is-ro...udience-score/

Possible rigging of the rotten tomatoes audience score.

[mae]

Never heard of that news source.

[webstar1000]

https://bleedingfool.com/blogs/is-ro...udience-score/

Possible rigging of the rotten tomatoes audience score.

I doubt it. You and Mattick are the only ones so far I have heard hate it. In fact I have heard nothing but love (with a few nit picks) from ale we gone else Nick.


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[Aremag]

I found Episode IX to be terrible....from the worst opening scroll of the 9 movies to the cringeworthy last line of dialogue and there was a ton of just terrible dailogue and humor that didn't work. The only main character that I cared about through the new trilogy was Kylo Ren and he was the only redeeming quality I found in Rise of the Skywalker. For the people who liked/loved it, I'm happy it could still be Star Wars for you. At least I have The Mandalorian.

JJ also had to get his overused lens flares in the movie...even though they were a tad more "subtle".

[Hunchback Jack]

Ep 9 comments:

Spoiler:

I thought the first 2/3rds of TROS were great. I really enjoyed it. Great chemistry between the three main characters, solid fun adventure stuff, some strong character development. Some nice callbacks to previous films without being too fan servicey.

The last 45 minutes or so, the movie got a bit messy, and I felt it lost its way a little. Character motivations became less clear. Some plot developments are set up, but others seemed kind of random. And there were two scenes where I literally recoiled from the screen, I felt they were so wrong. So I left the theater with mixed emotions. Certainly feeling better than I did after Ep 8 though.

[webstar1000]

Ep 9 comments:

Spoiler:

I thought the first 2/3rds of TROS were great. I really enjoyed it. Great chemistry between the three main characters, solid fun adventure stuff, some strong character development. Some nice callbacks to previous films without being too fan servicey.

The last third or so, the movie got a bit messy, and I felt it lost its way a little. Character motivations became less clear. Some plot developments are set up, but others seemed kind of random. And there were two scenes where I literally recoiled from the screen, I felt they were so wrong. So I left the theater with mixed emotions. Certainly feeling better than I did after Ep 8 though.

Could I ask the recoil scenes? I have one. Wondering they match up. Haha


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[Hunchback Jack]

Ep 9 comments:

Spoiler:

I thought the first 2/3rds of TROS were great. I really enjoyed it. Great chemistry between the three main characters, solid fun adventure stuff, some strong character development. Some nice callbacks to previous films without being too fan servicey.

The last third or so, the movie got a bit messy, and I felt it lost its way a little. Character motivations became less clear. Some plot developments are set up, but others seemed kind of random. And there were two scenes where I literally recoiled from the screen, I felt they were so wrong. So I left the theater with mixed emotions. Certainly feeling better than I did after Ep 8 though.

Could I ask the recoil scenes? I have one. Wondering they match up. Haha


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Spoiler:

When Rey and Ben kissed. And the final line of dialogue.

[webstar1000]

Ep 9 comments:

Spoiler:

I thought the first 2/3rds of TROS were great. I really enjoyed it. Great chemistry between the three main characters, solid fun adventure stuff, some strong character development. Some nice callbacks to previous films without being too fan servicey.

The last third or so, the movie got a bit messy, and I felt it lost its way a little. Character motivations became less clear. Some plot developments are set up, but others seemed kind of random. And there were two scenes where I literally recoiled from the screen, I felt they were so wrong. So I left the theater with mixed emotions. Certainly feeling better than I did after Ep 8 though.

Could I ask the recoil scenes? I have one. Wondering they match up. Haha


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Spoiler:

When Rey and Ben kissed. And the final line of dialogue.

One you got it. I agree with the first one... second didn’t bother me


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[Hunchback Jack]

For the second one, Perhaps not so much wrong as unnecessary. I get what they were going for, and I could see that it makes sense in the context of the movie, but it seemed to be pandering to fans in a way that didn’t really work for me.

BIG SPOILER:

Spoiler:

I Think it would’ve been more powerful if she hadn’t taken a family name at all, but still just called herself Rey. It would have been an affirmation of who she had become while still being a negation of where she had come from. As it was, I felt it was a contrived ending to create a victory For the Skywalker family, rather than just a victory for good.

[Lookwhoitis]

Uhhhhh...

Spoiler:

The name of the movie is
THE RISE OF SKYWALKER!