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    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

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    Default The prisoner of the...

    The Crimson King is the prisoner of the Tower the way I see it. He can't leave the balcony.
    Why did the Tower/Gan or I don't know did it to him? What would have happened if he could have reached the top? Did the Tower try to avoid something horrible?
    Would the same have happened to Roland if he had stopped at the balcony?

    Roland would have understood.

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    Numenorean ManOfWesternesse is on a distinguished road ManOfWesternesse's Avatar

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    God Letti, you always come up with the questions that force us to turn our brains (poor thing that it is, personally speaking) inside out!

    Well, something trapped old CK on the Balcony. Was it Gan, or the Tower itself. Were we told? (I feel a re-read coming on!). Why? Because, given his connection to the line of Eld the CK would, like Roland, have been able to open the door at the top - and that was not desirable to Gan/Tower/Whatever. WHAT might CK have done had he reached that room..... was the harm only that Roland would never then have reached it & was THAT why Gan/Tower intervened to prevent it?
    (I'm asking a lot of questions and answering none, methinks)

    On the second question, NO - I don't think Roland would have been trapped on the Balcony, I think that was a trap for the CK only (or for Mordred too should he have reached it first?)
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    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

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    Some more questions. Great.

    Roland would have understood.

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    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Letti View Post
    The Crimson King is the prisoner of the Tower the way I see it. He can't leave the balcony.
    Why did the Tower/Gan or I don't know did it to him? What would have happened if he could have reached the top? Did the Tower try to avoid something horrible?
    Would the same have happened to Roland if he had stopped at the balcony?
    Yes, Los' is the prisoner of the Tower which is Gan's physical body. It sure seems to me that Gan wanted to hold Los' there until the gunslingers could save the Beams and then they (Gan and the reborn Beams) would collectively weaken and entrap the Crimson King, to keep him from climbing to the top and destroying them.
    Mordred was Los's last hope of both helping the Breakers break the last beams and/or slaying the gunslingers before Roland could make it close the Tower. Mordred was also Los's last hope of releasing him from his prison on the Tower balcony, because he was at that point too weak to be able to do it himself.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

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    Numenorean ManOfWesternesse is on a distinguished road ManOfWesternesse's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by All_Hail_The_Crimson_King View Post
    ....the Tower which is Gan's physical body.....
    Good post CK. Not really sure I buy this bit ^^ though? You base that on anything specific?
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    The Tenant Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean's Avatar

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    on comics, as far as I know



    I've had a long discussion with the partisans of that theory somewhere, because for me this idea seems outrageously vulgar and oversimplified, comics or no comics. Moreover, I am not inclined to bring the comics into any more or less serious discussion, - but that's for another thread, too

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    Quote Originally Posted by ManOfWesternesse View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by All_Hail_The_Crimson_King View Post
    ....the Tower which is Gan's physical body.....
    Good post CK. Not really sure I buy this bit ^^ though? You base that on anything specific?
    Several parts of the series that I don't have access to at the moment and the graphic novels.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

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    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    When I get home I'll find the references for you, Brian. If I remember to. If the stars and planets are in the right alignment.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

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    Numenorean ManOfWesternesse is on a distinguished road ManOfWesternesse's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by All_Hail_The_Crimson_King View Post
    When I get home I'll find the references for you, Brian. If I remember to. If the stars and planets are in the right alignment.
    You can read it in the entrails of a chicken while you prepare dinner!
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    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    How did you...know...







    shhhhhhhhhh
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

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    Servant of Gan Brainslinger will become famous soon enough Brainslinger will become famous soon enough Brainslinger's Avatar

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    The idea that the Tower is Gan's physical body isn't just mentioned in the comics. It's something Roland speculates about in the field of roses. Roland could be wrong, but it came across revelatory....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brainslinger View Post
    Roland could be wrong, but it came across revelatory....

    Right. It sure seems at that moment he would know what he is talking about. Not pure speculation on his part.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

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    The Tenant Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brainslinger View Post
    The idea that the Tower is Gan's physical body isn't just mentioned in the comics. It's something Roland speculates about in the field of roses. Roland could be wrong, but it came across revelatory....
    Roland has never struck me as anyone who is very good at metaphysics or theology. That's precisely the vulgar idea he might have had once he had started, instead of relying to his hunches and intuitions immediately, to force them into words and categories. Too bad the comics autors followed him.

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    Big Coffin Hunter jayson is on a distinguished road

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jean View Post
    ... instead of relying to his hunches and intuitions immediately, to force them into words and categories.
    in buddhist terms, I'd say this is why he doesn't break free of his looping. only when categories of description are surpassed is enlightenment achieved.

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    Servant of Gan Brainslinger will become famous soon enough Brainslinger will become famous soon enough Brainslinger's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by All_Hail_The_Crimson_King View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Brainslinger View Post
    Roland could be wrong, but it came across revelatory....

    Right. It sure seems at that moment he would know what he is talking about.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jean
    Roland has never struck me as anyone who is very good at metaphysics or theology. That's precisely the vulgar idea he might have had once he had started, instead of relying to his hunches and intuitions immediately, to force them into words and categories.
    That's the thing though Jean, in that section you get the impression it is an intuition on his part, i.e. something that just occurred to him. Not deep theological speculation, something which I agree isn't something he is given to.

    I remember it being mentioned that whilst Roland does get things wrong, if he has a particular intuition about something, he tends to be right.

    I'll try and grab the quote soon so we can decide for ourselves straight from the source.

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    aka lindakins alinda is a glorious beacon of light alinda is a glorious beacon of light alinda is a glorious beacon of light alinda is a glorious beacon of light alinda is a glorious beacon of light alinda's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by R_of_G View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jean View Post
    ... instead of relying to his hunches and intuitions immediately, to force them into words and categories.
    in buddhist terms, I'd say this is why he doesn't break free of his looping. only when categories of description are surpassed is enlightenment achieved.


    The answer is within

    all matter is energy, all energy is GOD

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    Servant of Gan Brainslinger will become famous soon enough Brainslinger will become famous soon enough Brainslinger's Avatar

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    Ok, considering whether or not the tower is Gan's body. Here is a link to a post I did on another thread. (Save repeating myself.)

    PROOF FROM OUTSIDE THE COMICS.

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    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

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    It's quite strange to see such a short post from you, Brainslinger.

    Roland would have understood.

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    Palaver Castle Chef mia/susannah is on a distinguished road mia/susannah's Avatar

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    i think that the crimson king was trapped on the balcony so that he could not get to the top before Roland and so that Roland could save the beams therefore saving the dark tower.

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    aka lindakins alinda is a glorious beacon of light alinda is a glorious beacon of light alinda is a glorious beacon of light alinda is a glorious beacon of light alinda is a glorious beacon of light alinda's Avatar

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    Exactly so. that said, I was about to say that
    in my opinon we all are the creators of our own
    prisions whatever they may be.GOD/Gan it seems
    to me have no reason to imprison us..it is rather
    we who make the bricks out of our very beliefs.
    The CK perhaps set his own inability to proceed
    (his own trap) with his fear (s) and inadequacy.
    Post loosing his mind of course.

    The answer is within

    all matter is energy, all energy is GOD

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    Quote Originally Posted by Letti View Post
    It's quite strange to see such a short post from you, Brainslinger.
    Cheeky!

    You should see the post I link to. I talk more in that one. (Not as near as much as I did in that Callahan thread you started though.)

    Funny thing is, when I'm with people, I'm usually the quiet one sipping his beer whilst the others chat away. I guess I make up for it online.

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    Roont Matt will become famous soon enough Matt's Avatar

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    The CK perhaps set his own inability to proceed
    (his own trap) with his fear (s) and inadequacy.
    Post loosing his mind of course.
    I agree and I think his access to the Tower was blocked by fear long before he went crazy.
    The kindness of close friends is like a warm blanket

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    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    This fear keeping the CK trapped is very interesting but do you have any evidence of this within the series books or graphic novels?
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

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    Roont Matt will become famous soon enough Matt's Avatar

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    I didn't say his fear trapped him, I said his fear meant that he could never reach the top.

    I was just agreeing with the idea.

    I personally believe The Tower is a personal manifestation and so if we assume it is the "CK" Tower than it trapped him because of what was inside himself. Evil
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt View Post
    The CK perhaps set his own inability to proceed
    (his own trap) with his fear (s) and inadequacy.
    Post loosing his mind of course.
    I agree and I think his access to the Tower was blocked by fear long before he went crazy.
    Okay, if thats not what you're saying than please help me understand, where you say you agree to Linda's post above where she quite clearly states that she feels that the CK perhaps sets his own inability to proceed (his own trap) with his fear? It seems to work out to be the same thing.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

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