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Thread: Stephen King's new Holly Gibney novel "Holly" (September 5, 2023)

  1. #151
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    People have been saying King should retire for decades now. He writes because he enjoys writing. And IMO even if everything’s not a hit he’s had a number of his best works over the past 20 years.

  2. #152
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    The easiest way to test that theory would be to ask them if they'd take King's first 10 books or the latest 10 books to a deserted island.

    I'm not a "hater". He can still write. It's his stories that aren't doing it for me. Fairy Tale followed by Holly, come on.

    Like...James Hetfield still is the undisputed king of down picking at 60. The man is a machine. And then he sings on top of his playing. It's surreal to watch. But the songs sort of meander for eight minutes.

    TL;DR version: I'm being selfish because I want things that used to make me happy to keep doing that.

  3. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by WeDealInLead View Post
    The easiest way to test that theory would be to ask them if they'd take King's first 10 books or the latest 10 books to a deserted island.
    That wouldn’t do much to disprove the argument that “has King written some of his best work in the last twenty years” either way. I’ve often seen 11/22/63, Revival and Joyland being cited as being top tier King. Whenever there’s a poll 11/22/63 usually ends up being one of the top five picks for favorite King novel and Revival is often thrown around as being one of the scariest books he’s written.

    And while Fairy Tale was a mixed bag I personally got a lot of enjoyment out of The Institute and I thought Billy Summers was an engrossing read.
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  4. #154
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    The only King book from the last twenty years that I would even consider rating among his top ten would be 11/22/63. Most of the others would be among the bottom 20. I'm glad he is still around and writing, though. Even his awful recent books with their tiresome politics are worth a read. I can handle others having differing views. King is just a rich white guy who doesn't want any trouble from the woke mob. He can say whatever he is told to say because it has no implications on his life. No homeless on his sidewalks, illegal aliens running across his lawn, or concerns with crime in his neighborhood. Others bear the consequences of his opinions.

  5. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichardX View Post
    I can handle others having differing views.
    You called him a coward and a rat fink because he signed a petition in support of trans people.

    Quote Originally Posted by RichardX View Post
    King is just a rich white guy who doesn't want any trouble from the woke mob. He can say whatever he is told to say because it has no implications on his life. No homeless on his sidewalks, illegal aliens running across his lawn, or concerns with crime in his neighborhood. Others bear the consequences of his opinions.
    So you can handle him having differing views but you’re also saying King is at fault for the homeless epidemic and illegal immigration. Wow.
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  6. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberGhostface View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RichardX View Post
    I can handle others having differing views.
    You called him a coward and a rat fink because he signed a petition in support of trans people.

    Quote Originally Posted by RichardX View Post
    King is just a rich white guy who doesn't want any trouble from the woke mob. He can say whatever he is told to say because it has no implications on his life. No homeless on his sidewalks, illegal aliens running across his lawn, or concerns with crime in his neighborhood. Others bear the consequences of his opinions.
    So you can handle him having differing views but you’re also saying King is at fault for the homeless epidemic and illegal immigration. Wow.
    I called him a rat fink for throwing his fellow authors under a bus. He is a coward for doing so. Imagine how far off the rails the fringe element has become when they attack someone like JK Rowling. Not just disagree with her but vilifying and attacking her. If King has an issue with her, why doesn't he just call her up and express himself? Why join a vicious public hate campaign? She is a fellow author. Not a politician. He sold her out to show the world how "hep" he still is.

    No one suggested that King is at fault for the flood of homeless or illegal aliens. That honor belongs solely to Joe Biden. What I said is that King can virtue signal on such topics because his political opinions have no implications for himself. He espouses these opinions because he is afraid of the woke mob. I doubt he even agrees with them, but he doesn't care because he has his wall and private security to keep everyone out. If any homeless person or illegal alien showed their face within a mile of King's mansions, they would be arrested on the spot.

    By "handle" contrary opinions, I don't mean that I would be silent like a sycophant. It means I would not suggest that King be censored or imprisoned, as King and other leftists are doing to those that they disagree with, just because they have a different viewpoint. I will also continue to read his awful books. I don't advocate censorship or use of the justice system to lock up people for having contrary political beliefs. King used to be like that too. Unfortunately, that is no longer the case.

  7. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichardX View Post
    I called him a rat fink for throwing his fellow authors under a bus. He is a coward for doing so. Imagine how far off the rails the fringe element has become when they attack someone like JK Rowling. Not just disagree with her but vilifying and attacking her. If King has an issue with her, why doesn't he just call her up and express himself? Why join a vicious public hate campaign? She is a fellow author. Not a politician. He sold her out to show the world how "hep" he still is.
    Why are you lying? The petition didn't even mention Rowling, let alone "vilify" or "attack her". Not only that but King HAS defended Rowling and is still recommending her work regularly on twitter.

    In case anyone is wondering this is the petition in full. Maybe I missed a bit where anyone is viciously attacking Rowling.

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...hctywqxUc/edit

    Quote Originally Posted by RichardX View Post
    He espouses these opinions because he is afraid of the woke mob. I doubt he even agrees with them, but he doesn't care because he has his wall and private security to keep everyone out. If any homeless person or illegal alien showed their face within a mile of King's mansions, they would be arrested on the spot.
    You're projecting your own views onto him. King has been "woke" as you say for decades. The idea that he would have a homeless or illegal immigrant (how he would he even know their immigration status?) arrested just for being in his neighborhood is baseless and absurd.

    Quote Originally Posted by RichardX View Post
    I don't advocate censorship or use of the justice system to lock up people for having contrary political beliefs. King used to be like that too. Unfortunately, that is no longer the case.
    What are you even referring to? Trump being indicted? The people who attacked the capitol?
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  8. #158
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    Quote Originally Posted by WeDealInLead View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by CyberGhostface View Post
    Hate to be the bearer of bad news…

    https://www.thedarktower.org/palaver...ew-Holly-novel)
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    My review, sight unseen, in four acts.

    Unless the story ends with Holly being mauled by a bear and mouthing "Poopy" with her last breath, I'm not interested.

    Why can't these geezers retire gracefully? Dean Koontz with his boot licking and paranoia, Metallica with their "mid" riffs, Kiss/Motley Crue with their backing tracks, King with his bleeding heart (it's not that I even disagree with every thing they're saying, they're both just so ham fisted and CRINGE) ... youre all worth hundreds of millions of dollars. Just stop.
    Retire? Why? He's entitled to do what he wants. It's up to each reader to stop reading/buying his books, not the writer to stop writing 'em...
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  9. #159
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    Stephen King's interview for Rolling Stones starts with this quote:

    “I think that a lot of people are not going to like it,” he says. “I think that a lot of people — particularly people on the other side of the Covid issue and the Trump issue — are going to give it one-star reviews on Amazon. But all I can say to those people is, ‘Knock yourself out.’”.
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  10. #160
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    Kirkus Review with no spoilers or reference to potential political hot potatoes...


    Loyal King fans may disagree, but this is a snooze

    A much-beloved author gives a favorite recurring character her own novel
    .

    Holly Gibney made her first appearance in print with a small role in Mr. Mercedes (2014). She played a larger role in The Outsider (2018). And she was the central character in If It Bleeds, a novella in the 2020 collection of the same name. King has said that the character “stole his heart.” Readers adore her, too. One way to look at this book is as several hundred pages of fan service. King offers a lot of callbacks to these earlier works that are undoubtedly a treat for his most loyal devotees. That these easter eggs are meaningless and even befuddling to new readers might make sense in terms of costs and benefits. King isn’t exactly an author desperate to grow his audience; pleasing the people who keep him at the top of the bestseller lists is probably a smart strategy, and this writer achieved the kind of status that whatever he writes is going to be published. Having said all that, it’s possible that even his hardcore fans might find this story a bit slow. There are also issues in terms of style. Much of the language King uses and the cultural references he drops feel a bit creaky. The word slacks occurs with distracting frequency. King uses the phrase keeping it on the down-low in a way that suggests he probably doesn’t understand how this phrase is currently used—and has been used for quite a while. But the biggest problem is that this narrative is framed as a mystery without delivering the pleasures of a mystery. The reader knows who the bad guys are from the start. This can be an effective storytelling device, but in this case, waiting for the private investigator heroine to get to where the reader is at the beginning of the story feels interminable.

    Loyal King fans may disagree, but this is a snooze.

  11. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberGhostface View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RichardX View Post
    I called him a rat fink for throwing his fellow authors under a bus. He is a coward for doing so. Imagine how far off the rails the fringe element has become when they attack someone like JK Rowling. Not just disagree with her but vilifying and attacking her. If King has an issue with her, why doesn't he just call her up and express himself? Why join a vicious public hate campaign? She is a fellow author. Not a politician. He sold her out to show the world how "hep" he still is.
    Why are you lying? The petition didn't even mention Rowling, let alone "vilify" or "attack her". Not only that but King HAS defended Rowling and is still recommending her work regularly on twitter.

    In case anyone is wondering this is the petition in full. Maybe I missed a bit where anyone is viciously attacking Rowling.

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...hctywqxUc/edit

    Quote Originally Posted by RichardX View Post
    He espouses these opinions because he is afraid of the woke mob. I doubt he even agrees with them, but he doesn't care because he has his wall and private security to keep everyone out. If any homeless person or illegal alien showed their face within a mile of King's mansions, they would be arrested on the spot.
    You're projecting your own views onto him. King has been "woke" as you say for decades. The idea that he would have a homeless or illegal immigrant (how he would he even know their immigration status?) arrested just for being in his neighborhood is baseless and absurd.

    Quote Originally Posted by RichardX View Post
    I don't advocate censorship or use of the justice system to lock up people for having contrary political beliefs. King used to be like that too. Unfortunately, that is no longer the case.
    What are you even referring to? Trump being indicted? The people who attacked the capitol?
    Put it to the test. Take some homeless folks and/or illegal immigrants to King's neighborhood and see what happens. They wouldn't be there five seconds before the private security or police took them into custody. Just like the rich liberals did in Martha's Vineyard when they deployed the national guard. And no one is viciously attacking Rowling? She has indicated that she is scared for her life and the safety of her family. King is not responsible for the unhinged woke mob, but he has contributed to that culture by vilifying those with differing views. It's shameful.

  12. #162
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    You are continuing to lie. Neither KING nor anyone else on that petition attacked or vilified Rowling. They didn’t even mention her name. They just stated their support for trans people which is what I suspect your issue is with King here.

    And again, how would King even know someone’s immigration status? Why would he care? Are you using that as a shorthand for something else?
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  13. #163
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    Also, the homeless issue and illegal aliens has been an issue for well over a decade. It is no one single presidents fault. I hate Trump and don't care either way about Biden, I am neither a republican or a democrat, but both issues are a problem and will be for the next upcoming presidents. So I guess the next president will be the one at fault?
    If you don't like the idea of Holly, then don't buy it or read it, your choice.
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  14. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichardX View Post
    King is not responsible for the unhinged woke mob, but he has contributed to that culture by vilifying those with differing views. It's shameful.
    The very same can be said about JKR, using her considerable platform to espouse anti-trans views that are harmful.

  15. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberGhostface View Post
    You are continuing to lie. Neither KING nor anyone else on that petition attacked or vilified Rowling. They didn’t even mention her name. They just stated their support for trans people which is what I suspect your issue is with King here.

    And again, how would King even know someone’s immigration status? Why would he care? Are you using that as a shorthand for something else?
    Talk about lying. Rowling's comments were the impetus for the letter. It didn't have to mention her by name for anyone with a functioning brain to understand it was written in response to her comments. Good grief. Talk about disinformation. Are you an agent of Putin? LOL. This letter contributed to an onslaught of abuse and threats. King bears responsibility for that along with the others. Fortunately, some writers understand this.

    "Writers including Lionel Shriver and Ian McEwan put their names to a letter in the Times supporting Rowling in the face of “an onslaught of abuse that highlights an insidious authoritarian and misogynistic trend in social media”

  16. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichardX View Post
    Rowling's comments were the impetus for the letter. It didn't have to mention her by name for anyone with a functioning brain to understand it was written in response to her comments.
    That’s not what you said earlier. Here’s what you said King did before: “Not just disagree with her but vilifying and attacking her” and that King was participating in a “vicious hate campaign”. Which was a lie on your part as King never said anything negative about her.

    Now you are suggesting that by simply showing support to trans people King is responsible for any abuse or threats sent at Rowling.

    So in other words Rowling is free to speak her mind on the trans debate, write hundreds of tweets, participate in podcasts on it. King however simply saying “You matter. You are loved.” to trans people while still supporting Rowling elsewhere is stabbing Rowling in the back and is responsible for any negative reaction she gets. Rowling is allowed to say whatever she wants about trans people but King needs to keep his mouth shut because… Joanne has dibs on the topic…?
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    "They wouldn't be there five seconds before the private security or police took them into custody. Just like the rich liberals did in Martha's Vineyard when they deployed the national guard."

    The guard were sent to help: "Massachusetts Governor Charlie Baker announced he plans to activate the National Guard, among the relief efforts his administration is supplying for the 50 migrants who were flown into Martha’s Vineyard under Governor Ron DeSantis’s controversial relocation program.

    “The island communities are not equipped to provide sustainable accommodation, and state officials developed a plan to deliver a comprehensive humanitarian response,” said the governor’s office in a statement released Friday."

    It was just another stunt by the little Mussolini wannabe to appease the intellectually challenged MAGA sheep.
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  18. #168
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    Got 5 signed copies yesterday (ALL sold). They all went for $2500-2750 each. I should have a few more today I hope. They are 1st's too!! King has been kind in NYC signing!
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  19. #169
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    GMA?
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  20. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by webstar1000 View Post
    Got 5 signed copies yesterday (ALL sold). They all went for $2500-2750 each. I should have a few more today I hope. They are 1st's too!! King has been kind in NYC signing!
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  21. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ari_Racing View Post
    Stephen King's interview for Rolling Stones starts with this quote:

    “I think that a lot of people are not going to like it,” he says. “I think that a lot of people — particularly people on the other side of the Covid issue and the Trump issue — are going to give it one-star reviews on Amazon. But all I can say to those people is, ‘Knock yourself out.’”.
    This is the difference: not King's politics, but this confrontational approach - stepping out in front of a novel's release to draw a line in the sand and mock his ideological opponents - which is of much more recent vintage.

    Those who pretend (and it is pretending) that nothing has changed - hey, King has always been this way - can't be taken seriously.
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  22. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Mears View Post
    Kirkus Review
    Interesting review, which I, in turn, shall review:

    ...several hundred pages of fan service...
    Several hundred pages? It's 464 pages!

    Sir, this is a Stephen King novel - 464 pages is nothing.

    ...it’s possible that even his hardcore fans might find this story a bit slow...this is a snooze.
    We'll see - I haven't read Holly - but many are the King novels others have so described that turned out to be just fine.

    Much of the language King uses and the cultural references he drops feel a bit creaky. The word slacks occurs with distracting frequency. King uses the phrase keeping it on the down-low in a way that suggests he probably doesn’t understand how this phrase is currently used—and has been used for quite a while.
    Also, no problem here - we all age, and I don't want King to pretend to be something he isn't.

    Here's hoping it's a fine novel.
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  23. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by St. Troy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ari_Racing View Post
    Stephen King's interview for Rolling Stones starts with this quote:

    “I think that a lot of people are not going to like it,” he says. “I think that a lot of people — particularly people on the other side of the Covid issue and the Trump issue — are going to give it one-star reviews on Amazon. But all I can say to those people is, ‘Knock yourself out.’”.
    This is the difference: not King's politics, but this confrontational approach - stepping out in front of a novel's release to draw a line in the sand and mock his ideological opponents - which is of much more recent vintage.

    Those who pretend (and it is pretending) that nothing has changed - hey, King has always been this way - can't be taken seriously.
    King has always had this approach to criticism though. Recall his comments about popular fiction versus literary fiction.

  24. #174
    Let the Right One In CyberGhostface has much to be proud of CyberGhostface has much to be proud of CyberGhostface has much to be proud of CyberGhostface has much to be proud of CyberGhostface has much to be proud of CyberGhostface has much to be proud of CyberGhostface has much to be proud of CyberGhostface has much to be proud of CyberGhostface has much to be proud of CyberGhostface's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by St. Troy View Post
    This is the difference: not King's politics, but this confrontational approach - stepping out in front of a novel's release to draw a line in the sand and mock his ideological opponents - which is of much more recent vintage.

    Those who pretend (and it is pretending) that nothing has changed - hey, King has always been this way - can't be taken seriously.
    He’s not “mocking” anyone, he predicted (correctly; check the Amazon reviews right now) that people would be giving it 1 star reviews solely because of the stuff about vaccines. The same thing happened with Elevation because of the lgbt content. It’s more than fair for him to point it out.
    A hound will die for you, but never lie to you. And he'll look you straight in the face.

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  25. #175
    Can Toi WeDealInLead has a brilliant future WeDealInLead has a brilliant future WeDealInLead has a brilliant future WeDealInLead has a brilliant future WeDealInLead has a brilliant future WeDealInLead has a brilliant future WeDealInLead has a brilliant future WeDealInLead has a brilliant future WeDealInLead has a brilliant future WeDealInLead has a brilliant future WeDealInLead has a brilliant future

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ari_Racing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by WeDealInLead View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by CyberGhostface View Post
    Hate to be the bearer of bad news…

    https://www.thedarktower.org/palaver...ew-Holly-novel)
    🤒🤕🤢🤮

    My review, sight unseen, in four acts.

    Unless the story ends with Holly being mauled by a bear and mouthing "Poopy" with her last breath, I'm not interested.

    Why can't these geezers retire gracefully? Dean Koontz with his boot licking and paranoia, Metallica with their "mid" riffs, Kiss/Motley Crue with their backing tracks, King with his bleeding heart (it's not that I even disagree with every thing they're saying, they're both just so ham fisted and CRINGE) ... youre all worth hundreds of millions of dollars. Just stop.
    Retire? Why? He's entitled to do what he wants. It's up to each reader to stop reading/buying his books, not the writer to stop writing 'em...
    Correct. He can do anything he wants, including writing bad books.

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