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Thread: Gunslingers - discussion of their roles, social positions and functions

  1. #26
    Roont Daghain is on a distinguished road Daghain's Avatar

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    When there isn’t… I’m beginning to wonder if the rebellion led by Farson and used by evil forces didn’t have deep social roots
    I believe that was eluded to, possibly in W&G. I recall something about it being more democratic or something along those lines.



    "People, especially children, aren't measured by their IQ. What's important about them is whether they're good or bad, and these children are bad." ~ Alan Bernard


    "You needn't die happy when your day comes, but you must die satisfied, for you have lived your life from beginning to end and ka is always served." ~ Roland Deschain

  2. #27
    The Tenant Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Daghain View Post
    When there isn’t… I’m beginning to wonder if the rebellion led by Farson and used by evil forces didn’t have deep social roots
    I believe that was eluded to, possibly in W&G. I recall something about it being more democratic or something along those lines.
    I think this question needs discussing, too. Whatever gunslinger's ruling was, it was very far from a democracy; and, though it could be put down to the condition the world was in, no people can bear living under martial law indefinitely.

    Nikolett: there's nothing wrong with the title, it's clear and to the point.

    Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
    When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)

    bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  3. #28
    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

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    Democracy doesn't really exist at all... I mean... nevermind. It's bigger than me.

    Roland would have understood.

  4. #29
    The Tenant Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Letti View Post
    Democracy doesn't really exist at all... I mean... nevermind. It's bigger than me.
    I tend to agree with this statement. There's, however, some asymptotic approach thereto; while gunslinger's rule was a dictatorship based on the ideology of a myth (sorry, but I can't help being reminded of Fascism. Again.)

    Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
    When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)

    bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  5. #30
    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jean View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Letti View Post
    Democracy doesn't really exist at all... I mean... nevermind. It's bigger than me.
    I tend to agree with this statement.
    Are you kidding me? We... agree... is it true?

    Roland would have understood.

  6. #31
    The Tenant Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean's Avatar

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    yes love, wonders never cease!

    Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
    When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)

    bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  7. #32
    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jean View Post
    yes love, wonders never cease!
    And if we agree... we agree about very important and big things. Have you noticed it?

    ( - sorry / back to the topic - )

    Roland would have understood.

  8. #33
    Constant Reader Darkthoughts has a spectacular aura about Darkthoughts has a spectacular aura about Darkthoughts has a spectacular aura about Darkthoughts's Avatar

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    I'm going to have to dig up some quotes here, but I didn't get the impression that the Gunslingers were working under their own orders. They were part of a heirarchy, but certainly not on the throne.

    Also, your point about there being nothing to counterbalance their force...? Emissaries of the Crimson King don't count?

    I know we disagreed on this point in the other thread, but I do think you've let Roland colour your perception of gunslingers in general. Then again, you've lived in a very different regime in your real life, than I have...or even Sai King for that matter. Perhaps you do see implications of darker things because of personal experience.

    ps: I think you enjoy debate as much as I do - but in the past (not here, other forums) people have taken comments I make in debate personally, which is never my intention. I'm enjoying this discussion with you (as I do all discussions with you) so even if I vehemently disagree (as is my wont ) I hope you don't take offense or take me out of context

  9. #34
    The Tenant Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean has a brilliant future Jean's Avatar

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    Darkthoughts: the temperature (about 90F for about two weeks now) and my dental you-know-what are jointly killing me, so I postpone a detailed answer and will address only to the last paragraph of your post:

    Quote Originally Posted by Darkthoughts
    ps: I think you enjoy debate as much as I do - but in the past (not here, other forums) people have taken comments I make in debate personally, which is never my intention. I'm enjoying this discussion with you (as I do all discussions with you) so even if I vehemently disagree (as is my wont ) I hope you don't take offense or take me out of context
    My problem exactly, usually aggravated by the fact that I am not a native speaker, thus very often misinterpreted. I, too, tend to defend my point of view, and to not let go of my opinion unless faced with really strong arguments, which sometimes earns me a reputation of being pugnacious. I think everyone should very clearly understand that discussion is discussion, and, provided we all stay civil and logical, we all can argue as vehemently - or as placidly - as it suits our temperaments. I wish nobody would ever confuse criticising someone's opinion/position, however harshly if it seems necessary, with personal attack on this same someone; why else are we here (I mean the discussion threads) if not for disagreement and argument - in which, even if we don't get people round to our point of view, we at least can articulate our own position and make it clearer for ourselves; test it with the opposite side's arguments; temper it like steel (as opposed to amorphous "agreement to disagree" - which, of course, has every right to exist, too, if it suits someone's temperament).

    Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
    When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)

    bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  10. #35
    Roont Matt will become famous soon enough Matt will become famous soon enough Matt's Avatar

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    I have been doing this a long time Jean and I have never heard that said better.

    Thank you.
    The kindness of close friends is like a warm blanket

  11. #36
    Constant Reader Darkthoughts has a spectacular aura about Darkthoughts has a spectacular aura about Darkthoughts has a spectacular aura about Darkthoughts's Avatar

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    Hear! Hear! Extremely well put!

  12. #37
    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    I disagree and I'm terribly offended.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

  13. #38
    Constant Reader Darkthoughts has a spectacular aura about Darkthoughts has a spectacular aura about Darkthoughts has a spectacular aura about Darkthoughts's Avatar

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    But we try to offend you

  14. #39
    Roont Matt will become famous soon enough Matt will become famous soon enough Matt's Avatar

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    Yep, Matthew doesn't count.

    But I sure loved those comics last night, I haven't even had a chance to read them, just drool over the covers.
    The kindness of close friends is like a warm blanket

  15. #40
    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

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    Our Jean has power over words, everyone knows it. Hands down.


    Anyway... are gunslingers heroes in your eyes?

    Roland would have understood.

  16. #41
    Gunslinger Apprentice The_Nameless is on a distinguished road The_Nameless's Avatar

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    I always assumed that Arthur Eld and his gunslingers came after our time, with Eld being the legendary King Arthur being reborn. The once and future king.

    I have yet to read the comics, so I am basing this on the book series only.
    "Help me out here
    All my words are falling short
    And there's so much I want to say"

  17. #42
    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Nameless View Post
    I always assumed that Arthur Eld and his gunslingers came after our time, with Eld being the legendary King Arthur being reborn. The once and future king.

    I have yet to read the comics, so I am basing this on the book series only.

    Just curious, where in the books did it lead you to think that Arthur Eld and his gunslingers came AFTER our time?
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

  18. #43
    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by MonteGss View Post
    I've wondered how to reply to this thread/speculation since the day I joined this site. Honestly, I still don't know how to start. The thread raised some questions:
    -Hadn't the world already moved on by the time Gunslingers were "born"? At least according to Issue #3 of the comic. Arthur Eld established the newly christened knights/gunslingers after their battle with the snake and Mid-World had already been long-suffering and moved on.

    I guess I think their entire purpose, along with protecting the Tower, was to do whatever necessary to try to keep the White ruling. Serving as world ambassadors, PIs, bounty hunters and "the law" all worked towards this goal.

    Any more thoughts? Clarifications? Ideas?

    Cam-a-cam-mal.

    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

  19. #44
    Roont Matt will become famous soon enough Matt will become famous soon enough Matt's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by All_Hail_The_Crimson_King View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Nameless View Post
    I always assumed that Arthur Eld and his gunslingers came after our time, with Eld being the legendary King Arthur being reborn. The once and future king.

    I have yet to read the comics, so I am basing this on the book series only.

    Just curious, where in the books did it lead you to think that Arthur Eld and his gunslingers came AFTER our time?
    Says Eld was Arthur reborn.

    Meaning, the the whole thing basically redone is what I got from it.

    We were the great old ones...in the future for us, very advanced technology. We destroyed it, Eld and his crew rose out of the ashes.
    The kindness of close friends is like a warm blanket

  20. #45
    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt View Post

    Says Eld was Arthur reborn.

    Meaning, the the whole thing basically redone is what I got from it.

    We were the great old ones...in the future for us, very advanced technology. We destroyed it, Eld and his crew rose out of the ashes.

    Where does it say Arthur Eld was Arthur reborn? As far as I could tell, and I've read the entire series many times over, it elludes to the fact that Arthur Eld is the same person as Arthur in our world. Or a twinner. Also, it points to throughout the series that our world is not the same as Tower Keystone but its twinner, so we're not The Great Old Ones but have a potential of being like them, going down the same path etc.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

  21. #46
    Roont Daghain is on a distinguished road Daghain's Avatar

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    Hmmm. I need to check the comics. I just read something about that not too long ago, and of course I can't remember it exactly.



    "People, especially children, aren't measured by their IQ. What's important about them is whether they're good or bad, and these children are bad." ~ Alan Bernard


    "You needn't die happy when your day comes, but you must die satisfied, for you have lived your life from beginning to end and ka is always served." ~ Roland Deschain

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    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    I just re-read the part about Arthur Eld fairly recently and I don't remember anything about saying he was "Arthur reborn". Now in The Gunslinger it does say something along the lines of Arthur in this world and Arthur Eld in this making think they're twinners. Keystone Rose and Tower Keystone.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

  23. #48
    Roont Daghain is on a distinguished road Daghain's Avatar

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    Well, I am in the middle of painting my office, which means all the junk that was in there is now strewn all over my livingroom.

    I may find it in a few days. I honestly don't remember either way.



    "People, especially children, aren't measured by their IQ. What's important about them is whether they're good or bad, and these children are bad." ~ Alan Bernard


    "You needn't die happy when your day comes, but you must die satisfied, for you have lived your life from beginning to end and ka is always served." ~ Roland Deschain

  24. #49
    Life is beautiful LadyHitchhiker has a spectacular aura about LadyHitchhiker has a spectacular aura about LadyHitchhiker's Avatar

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    Perhaps they are on the quest for the holy grail...

  25. #50
    Hiiiiiiii. Spencer will become famous soon enough Spencer's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Nameless View Post
    I always assumed that Arthur Eld and his gunslingers came after our time, with Eld being the legendary King Arthur being reborn. The once and future king.
    I've always thought that as well. Several things that The Man in Black says in DTI (Revised Version) point to that.

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