My newest wild theory--which is really just an expounded upon version of one of my earlier theories--is that the Island is a manufactured habitat from the future, which ended up getting stuck in the distant past. They tried to fix it in ancient times, but didnt have the right materials to create the proper parts, so they rigged up a donkey wheel in an attempt to get back home. But it wasnt exacting and only worked to move the Island through space. The keepers of this habitat are the beings that we now know as Jacob and MiB. Through technological means, they are essentially rendered immortal, so that they can protect the Island.
Now here is the kicker to my theory. I believe that the Island is currently being built by the Dharma Initiative, with the funding of Charles Widmore. I also believe that the guy we know as the MiB (ie Smokey) is actually Charles Widmore, from the future. We know that changing one's appearance is no biggie for him, and he would definitely want to keep his identity hidden, since his past self would end up spending time on the Island.
Regarding Jacob, my theory on why he never revealed himself or ever had contact with Ben is because he is Ben, from the future. I think that the loophole may have been that the only way for Jacob to die is that he has to kill himself, similar to how the Others said that the poison wouldnt work on Sayid unless he took it of his own free will. Jacob is obviously a master manipulator, and so is Ben.
I know it is totally wild and likely entirely wrong, but it is still fun to hypothesize about. There are actually quite a few things that make a ton of sense if you think in terms of Jacob being Ben.
Anyway, I will leave this for others to murder with logic and whatnot...
Well, he was trying to protect Sayid, so there's that. But Jack has a long road to redemption before he's anything less than a doucheface in my eyes.
It'll take a lot more than words and guns,
A whole lot more than riches and muscle.
The hands of the many must join as one.
And together we'll cross the river.
I believe that the Island is currently being built by the Dharma Initiative, with the funding of Charles Widmore. I also believe that the guy we know as the MiB (ie Smokey) is actually Charles Widmore, from the future.
So, the actual island, or the mechanical and man-made portions (i.e. hatches)? In your theory I'm curious to know what would the purpose be of building the island?
I think the theory is interesting ... especially the part about the island being a manmade time machine/artifical habitat (which I guess would make sense because there seems to be a lack of natural wildlife on the island).
A true firewasp ninja would never wear such a ridiculous sweater.
Now here is the kicker to my theory. I believe that the Island is currently being built by the Dharma Initiative, with the funding of Charles Widmore. I also believe that the guy we know as the MiB (ie Smokey) is actually Charles Widmore, from the future. We know that changing one's appearance is no biggie for him, and he would definitely want to keep his identity hidden, since his past self would end up spending time on the Island.
Then why would he be spending so much time and resources on trying to "get back" onto the island? And how can his future self get on and off the Island at will? And why does his "future self" look sooo much younger and better then he does in the present?
I hope that it is confirmed that smokeys real name does start with an S (it was samael in the casting)
why?
Because of the sychronicity of Jacob, Samael (or whatever) and Jack, Sawyer
u heard it from me first!
if the worlds gonna end then let's get it over with, i got shit to do
I believe that the Island is currently being built by the Dharma Initiative, with the funding of Charles Widmore. I also believe that the guy we know as the MiB (ie Smokey) is actually Charles Widmore, from the future.
So, the actual island, or the mechanical and man-made portions (i.e. hatches)? In your theory I'm curious to know what would the purpose be of building the island?
The theory is that the entire Island was constructed as, basically, a time machine with the purpose of studying the past. It was made to look like an Island to camoflauge it, but the inner workings are all mechanical. I am thinking that the Dharma Initiative did not realize this when they were initially on the Island. They were researching the science behind space-time travel, and what they learned gave them the ability to create their own time machine, which they didnt realize was the same place.
The theory is that the entire Island was constructed as, basically, a time machine with the purpose of studying the past. It was made to look like an Island to camoflauge it, but the inner workings are all mechanical. I am thinking that the Dharma Initiative did not realize this when they were initially on the Island. They were researching the science behind space-time travel, and what they learned gave them the ability to create their own time machine, which they didnt realize was the same place.
Oh, I like that alot. If that actually happened (and was presented to the audience at the same time as the characters) I'd definitely be okay with that.
The reason i think the smoke monster form is closer to his true self is the picture of 'it' and anubis. But just because WE think of the smoke monster as an 'it' doesn't mean it doesn't think of itself as a 'who'. By now, we are pretty sure he's *some* kind of supernatural entity, and anything sapient would think of itself as a 'who', nomatter its body, right?
As for Jacob, I dont know if the for we saw was his 'real form', but i think on some level it was his real, mortal form, and that he really is dead. (But I also believe it's him, and not the 'nemesis', who visited Hurley).
-- Dark Tower connections! --
I've been thinking about this too, and it would be AWESOME if somehow they made a deal with King, and the bad guy turns out to be Walter/R.F./MiB. It would be pretty darn crazy.
That being said, them not being the same, I was amused by the 'Man in Black' nomenclature and it's DT ressonace.
I also noticed the Dogan/Dogan thing and thought 'hmm'. A few other things started to sounds DarkTower-y to me, but I can't recall right now. So, it makes sense that creators said they were DT fans.
The reason i think the smoke monster form is closer to his true self is the picture of 'it' and anubis. But just because WE think of the smoke monster as an 'it' doesn't mean it doesn't think of itself as a 'who'. By now, we are pretty sure he's *some* kind of supernatural entity, and anything sapient would think of itself as a 'who', nomatter its body, right?
Excellent post. Glad someone else brought up the anubis etching with "it" as well. I definitely think that the smoke monster is closer to its true self (MIB) as well. If we're going back to Egyptian times and it's relation to the show, theoretically speaking, the smoke monster would think of itself as a who if it has some Egyptian God-like origins.
On another note, has anyone thought that there might be two smoke monsters? A black and white? Reason being that Locke saw "the eye of the island" (which we can infer as the monster by the shadows and sounds) but said "what I saw was beautiful". So could it be that there are two, "monsters"? Maybe MIB and Jacob are both Egyptian God-like beings, feuding over something that we've yet to learn, completely unrelated to the island.
SOOOOOO wish I didn't have night class on Tuesdays (it gets out at 9:30pm, right in the middle of LOST!)... only for 5 more weeks though.
"The wise are not wise because they make no mistakes. They are wise because they correct their mistakes as soon as they recognize them."
-Orson Scott Card
I've been thinking about this too, and it would be AWESOME if somehow they made a deal with King, and the bad guy turns out to be Walter/R.F./MiB. It would be pretty darn crazy.
That would not be my choice.
Originally Posted by Roehcai
That being said, them not being the same, I was amused by the 'Man in Black' nomenclature and it's DT ressonace.
You know, it seems like everyone says that. I must be the only LOST fan who doesn't like it. I've always called him Esau after the biblical references. Then again, IMO there are only two men who can be called The Man in Black; one is in the Dark Tower and the other is Johnny Cash.
Originally Posted by Roehcai
I also noticed the Dogan/Dogan thing and thought 'hmm'. A few other things started to sounds DarkTower-y to me, but I can't recall right now. So, it makes sense that creators said they were DT fans.
Oh yeah. They're definitely fans. I really hope they keep it entirely separate, though, because I don't think they've made a sufficiently consistent connection. Don't they claim that they've had it planned all along?
Originally Posted by Tatts4Life
That was the weakest fucking explanation I've ever seen for the numbers. They better do a better job then that bull shit they did tonight.
Numerology? Why not that as much as anything else? Maybe in the LOST world numbers really do have power.
It'll take a lot more than words and guns,
A whole lot more than riches and muscle.
The hands of the many must join as one.
And together we'll cross the river.
It wasn't really an explaination of the numbers, as much as it was a 'tie in'. Whether or not Jacob used numbers in his list, that wouldn't really effect how often the numbers showed up. If anything, the mystery of the numbers is only enhanced by the fact that our main character happen to match up with them in Jacob's list.
Also, according to what Mr.Antagonist/MiB/FLock/etc said tonight,
Spoiler:
he was once a man. So perhaps was Jacob? That kinda negated them being egyptian gods, unless they somehow gained supernatural powers before that, and the Egyptians based their mythology on them (to some extent)? Or even their predecessors (if the island had a 'prisoner' and 'warden' before Jacob and 'MiB').
BTW, I really like your idea, Ricky, about there being two 'smoke-monsters'. Perhaps the 'pilliar of smoke' form is an ability both entities have. That would explain what you mentioned about Locke, as well as a few other things. For example, when one of the others (can't recall who) refered to the smoke-monster as sort-of a 'security system'. That would be true if they were talking about a Jacob-smokey, keeping the island secure from 'MiB'-smokey from leaving, as well as a few other things.
That was the weakest fucking explanation I've ever seen for the numbers. They better do a better job then that bull shit they did tonight.
I doubt we'll ever get a better explanation than that. However, did you notice one glaring absence? Kate isn't "one of the numbers."
Again like I said on an other board about Claires' sonogram, I think it's one of those things that the editors and producers fucked up on. The producers seem to really be slacking on the production and story this last season. I hope it gets better.
No -- I don't think this is a mess-up. I think it was deliberate. Kate wasn't on Jacob's list we were told in an earlier episode. Jacob told Kate not to steal any more when he rescued her from the store--and she disobeyed.
Pretty clever Bev! I didn't notice the absence of Kate and a number.
Any thoughts on who the boy is?
I really liked how they depicted Sawyer hitting bottom or dam near hitting bottom; but still with clever comebacks like "I better put some pants on!" And he still has his wits about him - he knew that Fake Locke wsa fake - he said Locke was scared and fake locke wasn't!
Sawyer is leaning towards Fake Locke but he did not give up Richard - still don't know where his allegience is! And now not sure if Jacob or Fake Locke is the good guy - or are they both bad guys - or whatever!
One thing I like that they have done with Hurley in both worlds - I like him in both! Can't say that about everybody now can I. Rose is cool in both worlds also!
One last comment - loved Frank's comment about the funeral after Ben gave his little eulogy/confession!
DT Spoiler - Enter at your own risk!
Spoiler:
I can’t remember if I cried
When I read about Eddie’s widowed bride,
And something touched me deep inside
The day the bumbler died.”
Click CAN' Ka No Rey for the entire poem, published in Lighthouse VI!
That was the weakest fucking explanation I've ever seen for the numbers. They better do a better job then that bull shit they did tonight.
I doubt we'll ever get a better explanation than that. However, did you notice one glaring absence? Kate isn't "one of the numbers."
Originally Posted by Bev Vincent
No -- I don't think this is a mess-up. I think it was deliberate. Kate wasn't on Jacob's list we were told in an earlier episode. Jacob told Kate not to steal any more when he rescued her from the store--and she disobeyed.
I also think it's entirely possible that Kate was never a "true" candidate to begin with and it's possible that she is there due to the Jack/Kate/Sawyer love triangle. Maybe her presence was required to ensure things went in a certain direction. Like Smokey/fake Locke/MiB said, Jacob has been manipulating them for a long time. But that's if you actually believe what he says. Without knowing how trustworthy he is I can't actually believe him and choose instead to wait and see.
A couple of huge questions created from last night's show:
- Is MiB a good guy or a bad guy? It's still up in the air.
- Who was the creepy kid? He was blond and dressed in homespun clothes with hatred in his eyes (ghost of a young Jacob maybe?).
- Was MiB going to kill Sawyer until he was reminded of the rules, or was that never his intention?
-And why, oh why, didn't Sawyer come up with a clever nickname for fake Locke yet? I was waiting all episode for him to call him something!
Another thing I noticed was the weird parallel between Fake Locke and sideways reality Real Locke - both at one point said, "You can't tell me what I can't do!"
Oh .. and Ben as a teacher.
A true firewasp ninja would never wear such a ridiculous sweater.
Heng Dai
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Originally Posted by Spencer
