Whose responsibility was...

[TerribleT]

::crawls into his den to brace himself for a reread::

LMAO

[sarah]

Cordelia's and Rhea's and Ka's. It all had to happen to start off the quest to the tower.

[TerribleT]

It all had to happen to start off the quest to the tower.

EXCELLENT point

[Matt]

Just to make my position clear, I really don't blame anyone but Susan for getting caught--she should have been a little more careful.

It was obvious the place was way too dangerous at that point and she really should have been carrying a gun I believe.

However, to the main question. Roland blamed himself for his lack of action where she was concerned, forever. More than forever--for all the universes in all times forever.

To me, if he was or not is moot because the man blamed himself. It colored his actions from that point on. It was his burden to carry and I agree with him that he should have felt guilty as hell about the way it turned out.

Same with dropping Jake.

[jayson]

Just to make my position clear, I really don't blame anyone but Susan for getting caught--she should have been a little more careful.

It was obvious the place was way too dangerous at that point and she really should have been carrying a gun I believe.

However, to the main question. Roland blamed himself for his lack of action where she was concerned, forever. More than forever--for all the universes in all times forever.

To me, if he was or not is moot because the man blamed himself. It colored his actions from that point on. It was his burden to carry and I agree with him that he should have felt guilty as hell about the way it turned out.

Same with dropping Jake.

Again, I agree with you Matt, but the question was who do we blame. I doubt anyone disagrees that Roland blames himself [if they don't think so, they are overdue for a re-read]. Like I said earlier though, do we not all blame ourselves at some point for something others would not? Isn't that one of the reasons we have psychologists in our world?

[Matt]

Yep, but I always considered them snake oil salesmen. Perception is reality and if Roland blamed himself, then it was his fault.

I know that seems strange but if we are discussing the character, he bore the blame, the blame was his. And I agree with him--he could have mixed Susan with the affiliation and his duties as a gunslinger, but never with the Tower. Very clear choice.

That choice killed Susan, the blame is his for that choice.

[Darkthoughts]

Like I said earlier though, do we not all blame ourselves at some point for something others would not? Isn't that one of the reasons we have psychologists in our world?

The other reason being that women finally realised if they wanted men to listen when they were talking, they'd have to pay them

[jayson]

I'm sorry Lisa, did you say something?

[obscurejude]

Yep, but I always considered them snake oil salesmen. Perception is reality and if Roland blamed himself, then it was his fault.

I know that seems strange but if we are discussing the character, he bore the blame, the blame was his. And I agree with him--he could have mixed Susan with the affiliation and his duties as a gunslinger, but never with the Tower. Very clear choice.

That choice killed Susan, the blame is his for that choice.

Well put Matt. Eddie didn't understand that and its almost like King put that scene in there so we could hear Susannah say that is exactly Roland's perception. At the end of Wizard and Glass we are primarily left with the question of whether or not Roland can be redeemed with his new Ka-Tet. He sacrificed Susan and became a matricide in the cause of the Tower. Both of these revelations are contained in Wizard and Glass for the first time.

[Dud-a-chum?]

I chopse option four, but really, Ka was at work as well, here.

Look; just because Ka meant it to be so does not mean that there weren't certain people who helped Ka's cause. The obvious people who arranged and allowed it to happen, of course, but I also feel it was partially Roland's fault. He chose to leave her, right? He had already begun to obsess. This is why I think Ka allowed his love to leave his life-- Roland didn't deserve to keep her, because he didn't choose her to begin with. One could argue with me that it was still too early to blame Roland, but I strill feel the way that I do about it.

[TerribleT]

I chopse option four, but really, Ka was at work as well, here.

Look; just because Ka meant it to be so does not mean that there weren't certain people who helped Ka's cause. The obvious people who arranged and allowed it to happen, of course, but I also feel it was partially Roland's fault. He chose to leave her, right? He had already begun to obsess. This is why I think Ka allowed his love to leave his life-- Roland didn't deserve to keep her, because he didn't choose her to begin with. One could argue with me that it was still too early to blame Roland, but I strill feel the way that I do about it.

*bites tongue until he completes the re-read so as not to prove his ingorance.*

[Childe 007]

Yep, but I always considered them snake oil salesmen. Perception is reality and if Roland blamed himself, then it was his fault.

I know that seems strange but if we are discussing the character, he bore the blame, the blame was his. And I agree with him--he could have mixed Susan with the affiliation and his duties as a gunslinger, but never with the Tower. Very clear choice.

That choice killed Susan, the blame is his for that choice.

The choice that made Susannah a gunslinger.

[DinoMay]

Has anyone suggested that Susan's death was her own fault? After all, the tipping point was her falling in love with Roland. She knew how dangerous it was for both of them and Roland even somewhat warned her, but she encouraged him to continue.

[Matt]

Sure Dino, its clear that she shares much of the responsibility for her position. I just really think that since Roland obviously blamed himself, there is no reason to consider who was truly to blame in the context of Roland's frame of mind.

[Letti]

Sure Dino, its clear that she shares much of the responsibility for her position. I just really think that since Roland obviously blamed himself, there is no reason to consider who was truly to blame in the context of Roland's frame of mind.

Matt, I blame myself for everything all the time I can only hope it doesn't mean that I really have responsibility for all those things... I feel that but deep inside I hope that we blame ourselves much more often when we should.
*keeps hoping*

[Malficeus]

In my estimation, the blame should be assigned as follows...

1. Cordelia [she made the ulitmate decision to follow Rhea and castigate Susan]

2. Rhea [for obvious reasons]

3. The entire population of Hambry except Sheemie for participating in such a barbaric ritual

4. Ka, for placing Susan in Roland's path

By the way, yet another great question Letti.

well that right there strikes the hammer on the nail for my opion

[sarah]

shit happens on the way to the tower. bad shit. doesn't everyone share a bit of the blame on a quest?

[Brice]

No...all the blame is mine.




Actually, I think I gotta' agree with that Sarah.

[alinda]

It was Stephen Kings!!

[Brice]

O Discordia!

[Malficeus]

It was Stephen Kings!!

but but how could you say something like that? just because he wrote doesnt me crap i mean what if he went through a door and saw it happen just like cort got some of his riddels?

[Brice]

It was Stephen Kings!!

but but how could you say something like that? just because he wrote doesnt me crap i mean what if he went through a door and saw it happen just like cort got some of his riddels?

I think she was kidding.

[alinda]

Wow! I was kidding, I didnt think anyone would misunderstand that.

[Malficeus]

lol i was 2 just felt like being smart

[MonteGss]

I take full responsibility for Susan's death. I only wish I could have choked her a little with my bare hands before I burned her.

I voted for Cordelia and Rhea though.