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MrsSmeej
06-04-2008, 08:51 AM
I have a confession to make... :scared: I don't like Richard Bachmann. Ohh, I don't mean I don't like his writing. After all, he has the same writer's toolbox as Sai King and I love King's works. I mean him - Richard.

Do I know how crazy that sounds? Of course I do. But, there it is anyway. Why? Because Bachmann is a pessimist about human nature. There is no room for the concept of a ka-tet in his world. Eddie would have reverted to his heroin addiction, and Mia would not have kept her word to Susannah in a Dark Tower written by Sai King's alter ego. John Cullum would not have stood and been true and the rose would have been carelessly crushed by a cruel and indifferent world. Bachmann's worlds are peopled with sad and somehow sordid characters. King's worlds admit the possibility of the heroism and helpfulness of strangers. Those are the worlds I prefer to dwell in.

Anyone else have a problem with Bachmann's outlook?

John_and_Yoko
06-04-2008, 12:16 PM
I haven't read enough of Richard Bachman (one N) to say for sure, but I didn't like the ending to Thinner. I didn't really read the whole book or pay attention to the whole movie, but I hated the ending--in fact, that turned me off to Stephen King until I discovered The Shining.

I guess the main thing to appreciate about Bachman's outlook is that some people have that view of human nature, and that element does exist, whether we want it to or not.

Having said that, however, I agree with you to the extent that I can. I prefer Stephen King's own outlook, and it more closely resembles mine (and it's not just because I WANT to believe it that I do).

Anyway, as far as Bachman goes, he's probably an outlet for King's darker thoughts, and so can be thought of positively in that way, I guess.

razz
06-04-2008, 12:34 PM
I've read just The long walk. i liked it, but everything you said screamed from every page of that book.

John_and_Yoko
06-04-2008, 12:39 PM
I'm actually thinking of (as an experiment) reading Desperation and The Regulators at the same time, just to get a good idea not only of how those stories in particular are similar or different, but to see clearly the difference between Stephen King and Richard Bachman.

That's of course, when I get to those--gotta finish IT first, and then I'm going to read From a Buick 8 before I get to Desperation and The Regulators.

MrsSmeej
06-05-2008, 07:40 AM
I actually have read both Regulators and Desperation at the same time John and Yoko, and Regulators is one of the few Bachmann books that doesn't hold true to my generalizations.

I read somewhere (in On Writing, I think) that King saw it as an experiment. He wanted to see what would happen if he took the same characters and dropped them in to different settings. Because he was afraid that his fans would be disappointed by two different books with so many similarities, he used the device of having Bachmann "write" one of them. I suspect that he wrote Desperation first. Once he'd created characters he liked, he found that he couldn't make them as dark as Bachmann's usual protagonists.

John_and_Yoko
06-05-2008, 03:20 PM
I actually have read both Regulators and Desperation at the same time John and Yoko, and Regulators is one of the few Bachmann books that doesn't hold true to my generalizations.

I read somewhere (in On Writing, I think) that King saw it as an experiment. He wanted to see what would happen if he took the same characters and dropped them in to different settings. Because he was afraid that his fans would be disappointed by two different books with so many similarities, he used the device of having Bachmann "write" one of them. I suspect that he wrote Desperation first. Once he'd created characters he liked, he found that he couldn't make them as dark as Bachmann's usual protagonists.

That's neat! :) And you've just helped me out there, for when it comes time....

And yeah, you're right--he did write Desperation first, he said he was about 3/4 of the way through that when he started The Regulators.

LemurJones
06-06-2008, 05:13 AM
I like what I've read of Bachman, but you're right. With King, the good guys have a chance of winning, little kids and old people have better odds of survival, and you always know that there's somebody looking out for us.

I will compare two books that are really different- Rage (Bachman) and Tommyknockers (King.)

A lot more people die in Tommyknockers, and there is a kind of horrific soul-and-entire-world danger in it, but the good guys win and the bad guys lose and the danger goes away.

In Rage, a handful of people die, in a sadly ordinary way. The killer isn't some hostile alien- isn't even really a bad guy- just a really messed up, completely sympathetic character who's lost his mind at a horribly young age.

After reading Rage, it takes Tommyknockers to cheer you up. That's awful.

I liked Rage a LOT more than Tommyknockers, though.

MrsSmeej
06-06-2008, 12:18 PM
Exactly LemurJones... Exactly. At least the good guys have a chance.

I guess I'm more of a glass half full kind of gal... And I usually feel as if some nice person is likely to come along and top it off for me. I've always suspected that Bachmann not only thought the glass was half empty, but also thought someone had probably spit in it before bringing it to him.

LadyHitchhiker
06-06-2008, 01:16 PM
I loved thinner... but you've got some valid points about bachmann's personality..

razz
06-06-2008, 01:19 PM
thinner kind of bored me.

LadyHitchhiker
06-06-2008, 01:20 PM
I liked it that he used sex in it... SK rarely uses sex...

John_and_Yoko
06-06-2008, 01:27 PM
I liked it that he used sex in it... SK rarely uses sex...

Eh?

razz
06-06-2008, 01:28 PM
what stephen king novels have you been reading?

LadyHitchhiker
06-06-2008, 01:28 PM
Thinner.. doesn't anyone remember? Gypsys? curse?

John_and_Yoko
06-06-2008, 01:29 PM
Stephen King uses sex all the time--he used it in The Eyes of the Dragon, for crying out loud!

LadyHitchhiker
06-06-2008, 01:32 PM
Hmmmmmm... he refers to it, a lot, but I think that was the most explicit I've ever read of his...

or maybe it just was my favorite one :D

The eyes of the dragon I actually *gasps* havent' finished yet...

John_and_Yoko
06-06-2008, 01:34 PM
Mea culpa.... :blush:

But that was early on in the book, and it's not exactly a spoiler, so....

LadyHitchhiker
06-06-2008, 01:35 PM
well one more reason to read it..
I guess this should be my point, in Thinner his sex seemed the most real in all of his references to it...

razz
06-06-2008, 03:50 PM
This cool Russian guy suggested Eyes of the Dragon too me.

MrsSmeej
06-10-2008, 07:08 AM
Sounds to me like your cool Russian friend has good taste Razz.

I've heard that King wrote the book so that he'd have something of his that his daughter could read when she was young... That's why the sex is not explicit. I enjoyed it very much and hope you do as well.

razz
06-10-2008, 10:14 AM
Oh, i read it months ago. Herr Barbarisch was very adamant about getting me to read it.

Ves'Ka Gan
06-14-2008, 06:01 PM
I actually really enjoy, dark tragic stories, and therefore I like Bachman.

I agree with everything MrsSmeej said...but I loved the books anyway. When I finished The Long Walk, I closed the book and sobbed. I was emotionally exhausted and the themes in that book are pretty depressing and tragic. And of course, nothing close to a "happy ending"...but I remember that book like I read it yesterday.

razz
06-14-2008, 06:08 PM
"and the second time, he found the strength to run" -The Long Walk, circa 1979, as Wireman would say.

obscurejude
06-14-2008, 06:11 PM
"and the second time, he found the strength to run" -The Long Walk, circa 1979, as Wireman would say.

:lol:

Thank you so much for incorporating Wireman.

razz
06-15-2008, 05:36 AM
wireman rox

Ves'Ka Gan
06-15-2008, 06:52 AM
"and the second time, he found the strength to run" -The Long Walk, circa 1979, as Wireman would say.
I think it has been at least 7 years since I read that book (I keep telling my mom to dig it out of the Garage & mail it to me) but that line seriously made my heart jump reading it...I think stories like the Long Walk are very powerful. No happy ending sticks with you and haunts you for life.

razz
06-15-2008, 06:54 AM
got to hand it to Bachman, the "guy" may be pessimistic, but at least he's a realist. or...as real as a science fiction novel can get.

Darkthoughts
06-15-2008, 11:19 AM
I thought that the interesting thing about Desperation and The Regulators, was that Desperation was much more a Bachman book, in that it was much more gruesome and dark than Regulators. I wonder if he didn't get his alter ego and his self mixed up a little there.

horrorfan2647
12-27-2014, 04:38 PM
I got very bored with Thinner and i never tried another one!