Susan and Cuthbert

[obscurejude]

What is interesting is that Roland meets Susan before his "tower infection." He is not compelled to embark on his quest until he becomes trapped within the grapefruit. I think it is possible that her and Cuthbert might have wound up together and would have probably been much happier- though not as intense. I think that is part of what King is trying to reveal in Roland as a character throughout the novel- as Susannah suggests at the end of Roland's tale, He understands Susan's death as a consequence of his quest for the tower. That drive in Roland is what made him and Susan perfect for each other but also doomed "Ka like a wind." Cuthbert did not have that same drive and this is one of the reasons he was such an enigma to Roland at times. How could you laugh in the midst of such a desperate and brutal existence? Cuthbert would have made a much better husband- Roland however, wasn't made for that lifestyle. Remember that Roland decides not to marry Susan after going todash within the grapefruit and seeing the tower for the first time. Cuthbert would not have had that response.

[Darkthoughts]

I think though that Susan shared Roland's intensity - albeit for different reasons. For that reason, I don't think she and Bert would have endured. I think she'd have found him too light hearted aswell.

[obscurejude]

I agree. I have tendency to over explain things. She was very intense. I wasn't necessarily saying her and Bert would have lasted, but that the possibility at least existed. I'm not sure the possibility was ever truly there with Roland.

[Darkthoughts]

Well, its debatable for the pure fact that it was cut short before it had time to blossom

I think they could've made it though. I mean, we get a glimpse of that settled side of Roland when we see him with Rosalita in the Calla.

[obscurejude]

True, but Rosalita knew it was only temporary from the beginning. It does show a certain side of Roland though. I guess we'll never know. They were both cut short. Its that whole combination romanticism yet rational determination that makes Roland so enigmatic as character.

[jayson]

For my part, I think Bert might have been a bit too hot-headed to keep his cool as long as Roland did in Hambry. Had Susan been his girlfriend instead of Roland's, he might not have been able to keep a lid on his temper watching her in the days leading up to Reap Fair and the boys may have been forced to leave town early. As it was he had a hard enough time keeping his temper with Roland about Susan.

[Wuducynn]

I've got to say that the idea of a ka-tet gang-bang with Susan would be wicked hot. How many holes of Susan's can Roland's ka-tet stuff and for how long?

[jayson]

I've got to say that the idea of a ka-tet gang-bang with Susan would be wicked hot. How many holes of Susan's can Roland's ka-tet stuff and for how long?

and we can see just how gifted in "the touch" alain really was.

[Wuducynn]

The Version of Wizard and Glass Never Released to the Public! YES!!!

[jayson]

The Version of Wizard and Glass Never Released to the Public! YES!!!

It's called Wizard & Ass

[Letti]

For my part, I think Bert might have been a bit too hot-headed to keep his cool as long as Roland did in Hambry.

What do you mean by cool here? When was Roland cool in Hambry?

[jayson]

For my part, I think Bert might have been a bit too hot-headed to keep his cool as long as Roland did in Hambry.

What do you mean by cool here? When was Roland cool in Hambry?

For starters, when he didn't respond to Jonas' destruction of their stuff and cursing of their mothers names [not that that meant much to Roland at this point] by going over to the Traveller's Rest and blowing his brains out. I am by no means saying Roland is the calmest guy around, but he was, at least at 14, more level-headed than Cuthbert. It's not a bad thing, I think Roland and Cuthbert complemented one another perfectly, the same way Eddie does for Roland. The one is more pragmatic while the other is a bit more given to follow his emotions. I simply think had it been Cuthbert, not Roland, who got with Susan that the probability of an early showdown goes up.

[Letti]

But Roland himself said that he made good decisions because of wrong reasons... so he was just lucky.
(Any I think Roland's mom was always very important to him. Even when he was so disappointed and pissed off.)

[jayson]

But Roland himself said that he made good decisitons because of wrong reasons... so he was just lucky.
(Any I think Roland's mom was always very important to him. Even when he was so disappointed and pissed off.)

I'm not saying his reasoning was always correct, just that Cuthbert seemed the more likely to get incredibly pissed off and lose his control, and if it were his girlfriend promised to Thorin he might not have handled it as "diplomatically" as Roland. As to Roland's mom, I know he didn't abandon her, just saying that Roland was possibly better equipped to deal with bad things being said about his mother as he had some negative thoughts about her to deal with.

[TerribleT]

I've got to say that the idea of a ka-tet gang-bang with Susan would be wicked hot. How many holes of Susan's can Roland's ka-tet stuff and for how long?

LMFAO

[Childe 007]

I think though that Susan shared Roland's intensity - albeit for different reasons. For that reason, I don't think she and Bert would have endured. I think she'd have found him too light hearted aswell.

And here is the crux of it all. What alot of you are neglecting is the character of these two characters.

Would Cuthbert have pursued her as doggedly once he became aware of her "situation" as Roland did? Would he have had the "intensity" to overlook that? Would he have wanted to? No, no and no.

Cuthbert would have had a fleeting regret that she was spoken for and got on with his business.

Would Susan have broken her vow and put her family's name at risk for anything less than Rolandesque determination? Would she have risked her life for anything less than the last champion of The White? Would she have gone to the fire for Cuthbert? Again - No, no and No!

So - had Susan and Cuthbert become lovers the Tower would have fallen.

I have never understood people's dislike of Susan. She was a full fledged member of that 1st ka-tet and was the Rose to Roland's Tower. Suasan was the 1st sacrifice. The blood that Gan and the Tower demanded of Roland/ The Eld to save the multiverse.

He was made a gunslinger - years before his time. He was given his life's love and had it taken from him as the price for that achievement. This 1st time Roland got the girl. After Tull - I'd imagine that it was always Cuthbert.

[obscurejude]

After Tull? What do you mean?

[Childe 007]

I believe that Roland always "draws" incarnations/ twins of his 1st ka-tet. When he drew Eddie he drew Cuthbert; Jake was Alain and Susannah was Susan. Right down to the woman bearing his child. That which he lost in the beginning - he gains in the end. All except the sacrifice - his true love. He had to choose between the gun and the rose and he chose the gun. Cuthbert chooses the Rose and would never have achieved the Tower. Eddie gets Susannah and etc, etc...

[Bethany]

Cool thread idea! I am sure I can PM you with some good IF questions.

I think Susan was a silly little girl and she caught Roland at an age where he was not quite the true gunslinger he ended up being. Both of them were really young and they believed they found some deep, true love. I've said my views in other threads.
If she had met Cuthbert first, I think she would have "fallen madly in love" with him instead. I know my answer won't be very popular but that is what I believe.

i heart monte.

i've said this many times but i do not think roland and susan were the lovers to end all lovers. they were 2 kids in love with the idea of being in love. i truly believe she would have fallen in the exact same way for cuthbert, or alain, or shemmie for that matter.

[Letti]

I believe that Roland always "draws" incarnations/ twins of his 1st ka-tet. When he drew Eddie he drew Cuthbert; Jake was Alain and Susannah was Susan. Right down to the woman bearing his child. That which he lost in the beginning - he gains in the end. All except the sacrifice - his true love. He had to choose between the gun and the rose and he chose the gun. Cuthbert chooses the Rose and would never have achieved the Tower. Eddie gets Susannah and etc, etc...

What an interesting view but to me Susannah and Susan are way too different to be twins.

[MonteGss]

Cool thread idea! I am sure I can PM you with some good IF questions.

I think Susan was a silly little girl and she caught Roland at an age where he was not quite the true gunslinger he ended up being. Both of them were really young and they believed they found some deep, true love. I've said my views in other threads.
If she had met Cuthbert first, I think she would have "fallen madly in love" with him instead. I know my answer won't be very popular but that is what I believe.

i heart monte.

i've said this many times but i do not think roland and susan were the lovers to end all lovers. they were 2 kids in love with the idea of being in love. i truly believe she would have fallen in the exact same way for cuthbert, or alain, or shemmie for that matter.

Yes! Thank you!

[obscurejude]

I've also said similar things. Thank you Monte, thank you Bethany.

[Letti]

ehhh

[Wuducynn]

Yeah, sorry guys, don't buy it for a second. I think there was a lot more to their love than just puppy crush.

[jayson]

Yeah, sorry guys, don't buy it for a second. I think there was a lot more to their love than just puppy crush.

same here. i don't like to think that Roland would risk everything, his life, his friends' lives, their mission, all bc he is "in love with the idea of being in love." for those who say 14 is too young to know what love is, it's allegedly too young to be a Gunslinger too, but he was able to do that. Roland is not ordinary. as for Susan, she literally gave her life for her love. that seems a bit more than just in love with an idea as well.