The DC Film Universe

[mae]

Since the overwhelming negativity about BvS has been blowing my mind all week, I have been watching and reading and listening to all the reviews I can, and I have come to realize that those people who did not like or actively hated the movie - it's their own damn fault. It seems like most people were expecting: 1) a Marvel-esque fun and light entertainment, even though every trailer made it clear this won't be the case; 2) the archetypal Batman and Superman, which these guys clearly are not; 3) a straightforward and linear story which is impossible with the kind of story this film needed to tell; 4) everything spoon-fed and explained, whereas we essentially begin in media res and you need to simply keep up with what's being shown to easily fill in any gaps that need filling, and for which no special knowledge or superpower is required. There is probably more stuff but these are the main points. I am astounded at the level of hate this film seems to be receiving from both the mainstream critics and the so-called online fan reviewers. What they're doing is just displaying their ignorance in full.

[webstar1000]

Since the overwhelming negativity about BvS has been blowing my mind all week, I have been watching and reading and listening to all the reviews I can, and I have come to realize that those people who did not like or actively hated the movie - it's their own damn fault. It seems like most people were expecting: 1) a Marvel-esque fun and light entertainment, even though every trailer made it clear this won't be the case; 2) the archetypal Batman and Superman, which these guys clearly are not; 3) a straightforward and linear story which is impossible with the kind of story this film needed to tell; 4) everything spoon-fed and explained, whereas we essentially begin in media res and you need to simply keep up with what's being shown to easily fill in any gaps that need filling, and for which no special knowledge or superpower is required. There is probably more stuff but these are the main points. I am astounded at the level of hate this film seems to be receiving from both the mainstream critics and the so-called online fan reviewers. What they're doing is just displaying their ignorance in full.

Well said... I find myself too trying to find why it was so despised. I thought it was AMAZING! I was on the edge of my seat... and in 3D IMAX it was just over the top fun. I really hope this doesn't affect what we see from them in the future. Marvel's jokes and light heated stories work but frankly... I am sick of them! This was a nice change... and CANNOT wait for the R rated Bluray to come out!

[DanHocker]

Since the overwhelming negativity about BvS has been blowing my mind all week, I have been watching and reading and listening to all the reviews I can, and I have come to realize that those people who did not like or actively hated the movie - it's their own damn fault. It seems like most people were expecting: 1) a Marvel-esque fun and light entertainment, even though every trailer made it clear this won't be the case; 2) the archetypal Batman and Superman, which these guys clearly are not; 3) a straightforward and linear story which is impossible with the kind of story this film needed to tell; 4) everything spoon-fed and explained, whereas we essentially begin in media res and you need to simply keep up with what's being shown to easily fill in any gaps that need filling, and for which no special knowledge or superpower is required. There is probably more stuff but these are the main points. I am astounded at the level of hate this film seems to be receiving from both the mainstream critics and the so-called online fan reviewers. What they're doing is just displaying their ignorance in full.

For the most part I agree. The movie was not without it's flaws. The pacing was all over the place and the editing could have been better. I feel like the mainstream critics wanted to hate this movie before they even saw it. They hated Man of Steel and they don't seem to like Zack Snyder. For me, this is not a Marvel movie and it shouldn't be. We need the contrasting tone, otherwise we'll just get 8 super hero movies a year that are all the same. I feel like people just can't get over the fact that this Superman is not the Chistopher Reeves version of Superman, or the Superman they read in the comics as a kid. This is an "elseworld" DC universe. It's not the same, it's like reading Red Sun or The Dark Knight, same concepts different take.

Ninja edit: I actually decided to skip my favorite movie podcast this week, because I know they are just going to rip it to shreds, and I'm just tired of hearing it.

[mae]

I'm not saying it's a perfect movie or the best movie ever made, but it's nowhere near the disaster it's being made out to be, and it does not have these alleged atrocious pacing/editing/character flaws. Could it have been better? Sure. But so could everything. I'm not a critic, so I'm not gonna assign this a grade, but as a huge DC and Batman fan, this is my third-favorite Batman film after the two Burton ones.

[Johnny Alien]

Since the overwhelming negativity about BvS has been blowing my mind all week, I have been watching and reading and listening to all the reviews I can, and I have come to realize that those people who did not like or actively hated the movie - it's their own damn fault. It seems like most people were expecting: 1) a Marvel-esque fun and light entertainment, even though every trailer made it clear this won't be the case; 2) the archetypal Batman and Superman, which these guys clearly are not; 3) a straightforward and linear story which is impossible with the kind of story this film needed to tell; 4) everything spoon-fed and explained, whereas we essentially begin in media res and you need to simply keep up with what's being shown to easily fill in any gaps that need filling, and for which no special knowledge or superpower is required. There is probably more stuff but these are the main points. I am astounded at the level of hate this film seems to be receiving from both the mainstream critics and the so-called online fan reviewers. What they're doing is just displaying their ignorance in full.

I agree with all of this as well. That is the Batman I have been wanting to see on the big screen since I was a kid. This movie really captured what is good about DC stories IMO. I too think critics want to compare all comic movies to Marvel and that is just not what this story was about. What makes me the most sad is that the poor critical reception will prevent them from making further movies similar to this.

I agree there are flaws. I for one am not a fan of the way Lex was portrayed.

[webstar1000]

I'm not saying it's a perfect movie or the best movie ever made, but it's nowhere near the disaster it's being made out to be, and it does not have these alleged atrocious pacing/editing/character flaws. Could it have been better? Sure. But so could everything. I'm not a critic, so I'm not gonna assign this a grade, but as a huge DC and Batman fan, this is my third-favorite Batman film after the two Burton ones.

My fav... Leger stole that show for me... this would be my second... and the original 89 version my 3rd.

[DanHocker]

I'm not saying it's a perfect movie or the best movie ever made, but it's nowhere near the disaster it's being made out to be, and it does not have these alleged atrocious pacing/editing/character flaws. Could it have been better? Sure. But so could everything. I'm not a critic, so I'm not gonna assign this a grade, but as a huge DC and Batman fan, this is my third-favorite Batman film after the two Burton ones.

My fav... Leger stole that show for me... this would be my second... and the original 89 version my 3rd.

I think this is my favorite portrayal of Batman / Bruce Wayne, not my favorite Batman movie though. That still goes to The Dark Knight. I like the Burton movies, but for me, like Reeve's Superman, it just doesn't hold up that well anymore.

[Merlin1958]

So I just got back from seeing the movie. Wow. It was amazing. I do not know what kind of crack the critics were smoking before their viewing, but they gotta ease up on that crap. I really liked Man of Steel but I didn't love it. I loved Batman v Superman. You don't even need to be a DC fan to appreciate what was going on. And those critics both in print and on YouTube complaining that there were "five" movies happening at the same time and that it was disjointed and messy - that just made me laugh. How hard is it to keep several storylines in your head? They always have an A story and a B story in every single TV show and nobody seems to struggle. This is no different. There are subplots but there are always subplots. There are dream sequences but there are always dream sequencers. This is nothing new. And it was not slow or boring in the least. When it was over I was like "That was two and a half hours?" Felt like the time just flew by. I was engrossed from the opening credits and it never ceased. It is dark but not oppressively so. It is more of an adult drama than your average summer blockbuster, which just means you need to keep up, pay attention, and not chew your popcorn too loudly.

Ben Affleck is a great Batman and a great Bruce Wayne. Michael Keaton will always be #1 for me, but Ben comes close. Loved him as both and loved the costume (both the regular and the mechanized). Henry was just as good as he was in Man of Steel, but because the focus was slightly more on Batman, he may not have shown as many sides of him or as often. Gal Gadot's Wonder Woman is powerful, cannot wait for next summer and the Wonder Woman solo movie. It will be insane! A lot of people, even those praising the film, seem to be still down on Jesse Eisenberg, but I liked him a lot. Most people also seem to miss the fact that he's not the Lex Luthor, but his son. He played the evil and crazy Mark Zuckerberg type perfectly and creepily.

I completely got why Batman and Superman were fighting, and I understood why they stopped. While I thought it was bad decision overall to spoil Doomsday as the main villain, and even though I would've preferred to not see that in the trailer, they didn't spoil everything about Doomsday. He was scary and tough.

A bit of spoilers:

I really loved the Justice League members and that whole little subplot. It's a little shoehorned in, yes, but I think it was one of the better ways they could've gone about it. It makes sense. And it was damn cool. The Flash was amazing. Ditto Aquaman. Not so sure about Cyborg. I trust in what they're setting up and cannot wait to see the Justice League in action!

I'm pretty much 100% on board with you here. Even with the Jesse Eisenberg thing, his performance was great, it just wasn't really the Lex I wanted to see. My Lex Luthor will always be the one from the animated Superman / Justice League show.

I'd agree wholeheartedly with both of you with one exception, Bale edges, Keaton as the best, Batman!!! LOL Only by a nose though. LOL

[Johnny Alien]

Affleck is the best Batman by a longshot.

[mae]

What's crazy about these negative critics is that a lot of them seem to have missed a lot of points, like who it was in that cameo warning Bruce and who was sending Batman those letters. Stuff like that which I had no problem following yet people that get paid for watching movies missed completely.

[Joe315]

Spoiler

the time travler guy in the dream sequence was night wing (sp?) right? And are you referring to the checks? I thought that was lex.

[mae]

It was

The Flash, but it wasn't a dream, he was using the Speed Force to go back in time and/or another universe to warn Bruce. And yes, Lex was sending Bruce and Clark the notes, yet some critics also missed that fact.

[webstar1000]

Affleck is the best Batman by a longshot.

NO QUESTION. Your 100% right in every way Affeck is the best Batman. EVERY WAY....

[webstar1000]

It was

The Flash, but it wasn't a dream, he was using the Speed Force to go back in time and/or another universe to warn Bruce. And yes, Lex was sending Bruce and Clark the notes, yet some critics also missed that fact.

Agree

It was the Flash warning Bruce.... I wonder if we will get a story line like we seen in the dream... reminds me of when Superman was bad! LOL LOVED Richard Pryor in that movie. lol

[Johnny Alien]

Spoiler:

I don't think that the flash was "warning" Bruce. It made it look that way and reinforced that maybe Superman was bad but I believe it was not to warn but inform him. Flash clearly said that he was "too early" so his message didn't make sense. But he said that Bruce was right about Superman and that Lois is the key and the ring is the key. My guess is that Flash is referring to Bruce thinking (in the near future) that Superman is not 100% dead and that is why he said "you were right about superman" and that he is letting him know that lois and ring are the key to bringing him back. This is hinted to at the end when the camera was zoomed in on the ring holding the dirt and that the dirt that touched the ring started floating. This is all a theory of course.

The Superman controlled future was just a dream, the Flash part really happened...the two being close together gave Bruce and the audience the feeling that they were tied together but they weren't.

[webstar1000]

Spoiler:

I don't think that the flash was "warning" Bruce. It made it look that way and reinforced that maybe Superman was bad but I believe it was not to warn but inform him. Flash clearly said that he was "too early" so his message didn't make sense. But he said that Bruce was right about Superman and that Lois is the key and the ring is the key. My guess is that Flash is referring to Bruce thinking (in the near future) that Superman is not 100% dead and that is why he said "you were right about superman" and that he is letting him know that lois and ring are the key to bringing him back. This is hinted to at the end when the camera was zoomed in on the ring holding the dirt and that the dirt that touched the ring started floating. This is all a theory of course.

The Superman controlled future was just a dream, the Flash part really happened...the two being close together gave Bruce and the audience the feeling that they were tied together but they weren't.

but...

HOW COOL would it be for this to be true. The reason I lean towards your ideas is cause when Superman rips Batman's mask off... it was like he was seeing WHO he was under there when we all know he knows by this time that is supposedly in the future! Make sense? lol I still like the idea of this storyline.. DARK.. and that is what DC needs. More art like and dark like.

[DanHocker]

Spoiler:

I have some theories on Justice League. I think we're going to get more "visions" of the future and The Flash coming back in time to tell Bruce he has to bring Superman back. I will not be surprised if Superman is dead for the first half of the movie. I think that dream was a possible Future. One that would have come to pass had they not reconciled and Martha had died. It's really hard to say though. The reason I feel it was less of a dream and more of a possible future, is all of the Darksied references and the para demons.

[mae]

[webstar1000]

love...

All these spoilers... lol

[T-Dogz_AK47]

It's official. Batman vs Superman is the Donald Trump of comic book super hero movies, y'all! LOL!

http://variety.com/2016/film/news/batman-v-superman-donald-trump-reviews-1201740341/

[Merlin1958]

I enjoyed it, but there were/are some serious issues with it as a whole. The biggest one to jump out at me was the editing. It was jumping all over the place!!! The dream sequences, WTF?

Spoiler:

And "Doomsday"???? WTF?

[mtdman]

I had no issues with the dream sequences. I've heard other people complain about them. I thought they were fine.

I think a lot of the editing is due to them chopping the movie to get it down in time, and to get the R rating down to Pg13.

I have a couple of thoughts on the critics reviews. One, I think because we have been waiting for so long for this movie, that it has been in the can for a while during post production, that the critics were just waiting to rip on it. Because it is DC, it is dark, and it's not Marvel. And because they had nothing better to do than build up animosity toward it for the last 2 years.

Also, this movie is pretty close to being a fan boy movie. The fight with Batman and Superman, a lot of the Batman stuff, is straight from The Dark Knight. Straight from that book. A lot of the Superman fighting Doomsday stuff is straight from Death of Superman. Fan boys have been clamoring for years for material based off the books more, and they finally got it. Hence the strong fan reaction, and the strong negative reaction by people that have no idea what is going on with the inside stuff.

The surprising part for me is that I am dying to see the new Wonder Woman movie next year after her appearance in BvS. She obviously stole the show, and her entrance was incredible. I am anxious to see what she can do in her own movie.

The only disappointing thing to me is that the actress playing her is so skinny. I'd like to see a beefier woman play the role. Gal looks like she could break. Someone more athletic would be more believable, imo.

[mae]

[mtdman]

Anybody see the Killing Joke preview? So excited for this movie. Supposed to be rated R.

[mae]

Yup was just about to post it: