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Thread: The children...

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    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

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    Default The children...

    Okay, I have one bog question here and some little ones and of course I am interested in your thoughts.
    Why did the wolves or whoever else send back the roont children? What was the point? To make the Calla folks even more fragile?

    I have never met such an unlucky and suffered village as the Calla. To lose their children all the time and get them back that way... Not just once but time to time. I respect them that they didn't get insane and they could contiue their lives and they tried to look after their brothers and sisters or children as much as possible.

    Roland would have understood.

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    Citizen of Gilead TerribleT is on a distinguished road TerribleT's Avatar

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    Someone needed a sister to plow.

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    Big Coffin Hunter jayson is on a distinguished road

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    good one T!

    it is a good question Letti. i would think they [the forces of the King] sent the roont ones back bc it was even more cruel than simply killing them. to have their children back in such a way had to be heartbreaking for the parents who always had the other twin to remind them of the potential both had, and then to watch the roont ones live in such pain until they passed away. if they just kidnapped and killed them the hurt all comes at once. the way they did it, the hurt continues. i think it was just more cruelty on the part of the CK.

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    Numenorean ManOfWesternesse is on a distinguished road ManOfWesternesse's Avatar

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    Yes, can only have been the added cruelty.
    They only wanted one thing from the kids, and that was extracted using the weird contraption Susannah/Mia used later. After that the kids were no use alive or dead to them.
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    Little Red Headed Girl Bethany is a name known to all Bethany is a name known to all Bethany is a name known to all Bethany is a name known to all Bethany is a name known to all Bethany is a name known to all Bethany's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by R_of_G View Post
    good one T!

    it is a good question Letti. i would think they [the forces of the King] sent the roont ones back bc it was even more cruel than simply killing them. to have their children back in such a way had to be heartbreaking for the parents who always had the other twin to remind them of the potential both had, and then to watch the roont ones live in such pain until they passed away. if they just kidnapped and killed them the hurt all comes at once. the way they did it, the hurt continues. i think it was just more cruelty on the part of the CK.
    building on this, i think the roonts were also sent to remind the calla who was in control and what they were capable of doing to the people.
    Based on a true story

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    Big Coffin Hunter jayson is on a distinguished road

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    Quote Originally Posted by bethany View Post
    i think the roonts were also sent to remind the calla who was in control and what they were capable of doing to the people.
    definitely. living reminders of just what was possible from their enemies.

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    Guardian of the Beam Storyslinger will become famous soon enough Storyslinger will become famous soon enough Storyslinger's Avatar

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    Cruelty are my only thoughts.

    It strikes me as a bit weird though

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    Big Coffin Hunter jayson is on a distinguished road

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    excellent points made Jean. i see the logic of the "we're not as bad as they say, see we returned the children, didn't we?" propaganda strategy.

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    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    I don't buy that reasoning. I don't think they care about spreading the idea that there is good behind what they're doing. I think its the idea about fostering fear of them that they're concerned with. The children are sent back with the implied message of.."See whats happened to them?" as part of generations of fear, keeping the Callas in line.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

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    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

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    I am with AllHail with that one. For me it's unbelievable that they sent back children to show how good and warm-hearted they were... ahhh. If that was the reason it was just a very cruel joke they laughed their asses off.

    Roland would have understood.

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    The White! MonteGss is on a distinguished road MonteGss's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by All_Hail_The_Crimson_King View Post
    I don't buy that reasoning. I don't think they care about spreading the idea that there is good behind what they're doing. I think its the idea about fostering fear of them that they're concerned with. The children are sent back with the implied message of.."See whats happened to them?" as part of generations of fear, keeping the Callas in line.
    Spot on. This was the impression I had. They were being intentionally malicious. "Rub it in their faces."

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    Interplay Fan HanzouNorak is on a distinguished road HanzouNorak's Avatar

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    makes perfect sense to me, the wolves aren't going to waste their time killing them, so send them back an accomplish;
    a threat to the Callas,
    disposing of them.

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    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by HanzouNorak View Post
    makes perfect sense to me, the wolves aren't going to waste their time killing them, so send them back an accomplish;
    a threat to the Callas,
    disposing of them.
    If you ask me sending them back takes more time than killing them.
    Just imagine those crying stupid kids... it can't be easy to put them on a train. I am sure it would have been much easier to kill them.

    Roland would have understood.

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    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

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    A new question came to my mind...

    Did the Wolves and their lords need only Calla twins? I mean were Calla twins different from any other twins or the Wolves could have used twins for example from our world, too?

    Roland would have understood.

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    Numenorean ManOfWesternesse is on a distinguished road ManOfWesternesse's Avatar

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    You're full of questions Letti!

    A good one though.
    I think the only requirement was for twins, and the special mental bond they share. So any twins would serve.
    The beauty of the Callas for them was in the fact that twins (as opposed to singletons) were the norm there, as opposed to the exception they are in our world. Hence a big ready-supply for the Wolves.
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    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

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    Okay. Let's imagine twin sisters. One of them dies at a very young age (when she is just some weeks old) and the other one stays alone and grows up alone.
    10 years later would that single child do any use for the Wolves? What do you think?
    I don't know if it makes any sense right now to you but I think even if you are a twin, if you don't have your twin sister to share your khef with - sooner or later you will lose your abilities or they will not develope at all.
    The wolves didn't take children around the age of 1... and they didn't take too old ones, either.
    Complex, isn't it?

    Roland would have understood.

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    Numenorean ManOfWesternesse is on a distinguished road ManOfWesternesse's Avatar

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    Complex indeed.

    True they did not take them too young or too old.
    Was this because they could not be 'used' -or because they would be too much trouble to manage?

    The question of a surviving sibling, where one twin had died, was raised in the Book of course. Benny Slightman the younger was a surviving Twin was'nt he? Did we ever get a straight answer as to whether the Wolves would take him or leave him? (Damn my ever-faulty memory!)
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    Big Coffin Hunter jayson is on a distinguished road

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    Quote Originally Posted by ManOfWesternesse View Post
    Complex indeed.

    True they did not take them too young or too old.
    Was this because they could not be 'used' -or because they would be too much trouble to manage?

    The question of a surviving sibling, where one twin had died, was raised in the Book of course. Benny Slightman the younger was a surviving Twin was'nt he? Did we ever get a straight answer as to whether the Wolves would take him or leave him? (Damn my ever-faulty memory!)
    i think it is at least strongly implied that benny is still useful to the wolves bc he was a twin, and that's why andy can get slightman the elder to help. if he knew the wolves couldn't take his son, he'd be less likely to sell out his friends' children.

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    Numenorean ManOfWesternesse is on a distinguished road ManOfWesternesse's Avatar

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    ^^ that was exactly my recollection too. Benny was the lever used to recruit his father.
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    Wolf Woofer will become famous soon enough Woofer will become famous soon enough Woofer's Avatar

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    They're main concern is to ensure a steady supply of twins. To that end, I think that returning the roont twin is serves a dual purpose:
    1. To make them more fragile.
    2. To ensure they continue to reproduce - after all, they haven't lost both, right?
    A twin whose twin died at a young age would still be useful. The surviving twin serves as leverage over the parents.
    It'll take a lot more than words and guns,
    A whole lot more than riches and muscle.

    The hands of the many must join as one.
    And together we'll cross the river.

    Puscifer, "The Humbling River"


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    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Woofer View Post
    They're main concern is to ensure a steady supply of twins. To that end, I think that returning the roont twin is serves a dual purpose:
    1. To make them more fragile.
    2. To ensure they continue to reproduce - after all, they haven't lost both, right?
    A twin whose twin died at a young age would still be useful. The surviving twin serves as leverage over the parents.
    The twins weren't fertile so they couldn't reproduce. The steady supply of twins was something I think comes from some kind of spell or science of the Red. The Callas were the Crimson King's farms afterall for his breakers.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

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    Wolf Woofer will become famous soon enough Woofer will become famous soon enough Woofer's Avatar

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    Oops, confusion! I was unclear. I didn't mean the roont twin would reproduce, but that the parents would continue to reproduce. If you rob someone of everything, then they lose hope. Hence, the roont twin is return to allow just enough hope to keep the Calla folk in place and breeding.

    Have to run to work. Hope that was clearer.
    It'll take a lot more than words and guns,
    A whole lot more than riches and muscle.

    The hands of the many must join as one.
    And together we'll cross the river.

    Puscifer, "The Humbling River"


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    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Woofer View Post
    Oops, confusion! I was unclear. I didn't mean the roont twin would reproduce, but that the parents would continue to reproduce. If you rob someone of everything, then they lose hope. Hence, the roont twin is return to allow just enough hope to keep the Calla folk in place and breeding.

    Have to run to work. Hope that was clearer.
    I got you now. I still say returning the children had nothing to do with anything beyond instilling generations of fear in the Callas. The high twin reproduction was just something that they were given by some kind of magic.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

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    Numenorean ManOfWesternesse is on a distinguished road ManOfWesternesse's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by All_Hail_The_Crimson_King View Post
    .....The steady supply of twins was something I think comes from some kind of spell or science of the Red. The Callas were the Crimson King's farms afterall for his breakers.
    You reckon?
    I was wondering about this, and assumed it was just something inherent in the population of that area.
    Had'nt occured to me that they were being ......genetically manipulated in some way by the Red to ensure the outcome.
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    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by ManOfWesternesse View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by All_Hail_The_Crimson_King View Post
    .....The steady supply of twins was something I think comes from some kind of spell or science of the Red. The Callas were the Crimson King's farms afterall for his breakers.
    You reckon?
    I was wondering about this, and assumed it was just something inherent in the population of that area.
    Had'nt occured to me that they were being ......genetically manipulated in some way by the Red to ensure the outcome.
    I do. It makes sense if you think about it...the Callas are convenient, bordering on Thunderclap afterall. At some point in relatively distant past but not time out of mind, the Crimson King cast some kind of spell on them. Or had his scientists do some kind of genetic engineering on their population.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

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