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Thread: Suntup Press

  1. #5201
    Honky Mahfah zelig has a reputation beyond repute zelig has a reputation beyond repute zelig has a reputation beyond repute zelig has a reputation beyond repute zelig has a reputation beyond repute zelig has a reputation beyond repute zelig has a reputation beyond repute zelig has a reputation beyond repute zelig has a reputation beyond repute zelig has a reputation beyond repute zelig has a reputation beyond repute zelig's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phalucha View Post
    I am of the view that introductions and afterwords by random people however well known or creative in their own right are meaningless.
    As a point of clarification, are you making a general statement, or are you suggesting that we select intro authors at random, based primarily on how big a name they are, as opposed to their connection to the novel? As you mentioned Polanski, Iím assuming your statement was not of a general nature, and specific to this book, but I wanted to clarify.

  2. #5202
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phalucha View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zelig View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Phalucha View Post
    I am of the view that introductions and afterwords by random people however well known or creative in their own right are meaningless.
    As a point of clarification, are you making a general statement, or are you suggesting that we select intro authors at random, based primarily on how big a name they are, as opposed to their connection to the novel? As you mentioned Polanski, Iím assuming your statement was not of a general nature, and specific to this book, but I wanted to clarify.
    General statement Paul. I have no insights on your selection process and definitely not suggesting you chase big names. I use Polanski as an example of someone that has a clear and indisputable connection To Rosemaryís Baby and whoís views and signature would enhance the value of the book. At least for me.
    Okay thanks. As a general rule, I tend stay away from directors of movies which are adaptations of a novel, for introductions. The movie is the movie, and the book is the book. I sort of compartmentalize each, as different mediums. I'd sooner go after an author whose work was inspired or influenced by the novel in some way. There's definitely exceptions.

    From a purely 'surgical' standpoint, I'd actually prefer not to include introductions. They add months to the production cycle of the book, cost more money, and create additional administrative work in shipping signature sheets back and forth. One could say that the work stands on its own, and does not require an introduction (there's one of those on the horizon.)

    On the other hand, I understand the importance of a signature to many of our customers, especially in the case of a deceased author. Signatures are something else I could discuss at length, but that's for another time. Also, I do see the value in publishing an introduction. They can add context to a work, or offer an interesting viewpoint. Joe Hill's intro to Horns comes to mind. I learned something new having read it, which I was not aware of before.

    Maybe it's helpful to know that when we consider possible candidates for writing introductions, we look for authors who have a connection to the work. That's a given. We spend a fair amount of time researching this, and we also receive input from the author's Estate from whom we also require approval. Of primary importance is, how is this author connected to the work. This is not the introduction-version of a remarque by an artist who has absolutely nothing to do with the book. I agree, that would not make sense.

  3. #5203
    Gunslinger Apprentice Munnecom has a spectacular aura about Munnecom has a spectacular aura about

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    Quote Originally Posted by zelig View Post
    Signatures are something else I could discuss at length, but that's for another time.
    Please do, Iíd love to hear your thoughts.

    I like signed books, but ultimately, signatures - even from the author - are low on my list of things I want from fine-press books. A quality binding, some kind of slip- or traycase, paper and printing quality, illustrations and trim size are all more important to me.

  4. #5204
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    Quote Originally Posted by Munnecom View Post

    Please do, Iíd love to hear your thoughts.
    Yes please. I would love to hear your thoughts and opinions on this, as one of the top creators in our field.

  5. #5205
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    Quote Originally Posted by zelig View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Phalucha View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zelig View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Phalucha View Post
    I am of the view that introductions and afterwords by random people however well known or creative in their own right are meaningless.
    As a point of clarification, are you making a general statement, or are you suggesting that we select intro authors at random, based primarily on how big a name they are, as opposed to their connection to the novel? As you mentioned Polanski, Iím assuming your statement was not of a general nature, and specific to this book, but I wanted to clarify.
    General statement Paul. I have no insights on your selection process and definitely not suggesting you chase big names. I use Polanski as an example of someone that has a clear and indisputable connection To Rosemaryís Baby and whoís views and signature would enhance the value of the book. At least for me.
    Okay thanks. As a general rule, I tend stay away from directors of movies which are adaptations of a novel, for introductions. The movie is the movie, and the book is the book. I sort of compartmentalize each, as different mediums. I'd sooner go after an author whose work was inspired or influenced by the novel in some way. There's definitely exceptions.

    From a purely 'surgical' standpoint, I'd actually prefer not to include introductions. They add months to the production cycle of the book, cost more money, and create additional administrative work in shipping signature sheets back and forth. One could say that the work stands on its own, and does not require an introduction (there's one of those on the horizon.)

    On the other hand, I understand the importance of a signature to many of our customers, especially in the case of a deceased author. Signatures are something else I could discuss at length, but that's for another time. Also, I do see the value in publishing an introduction. They can add context to a work, or offer an interesting viewpoint. Joe Hill's intro to Horns comes to mind. I learned something new having read it, which I was not aware of before.

    Maybe it's helpful to know that when we consider possible candidates for writing introductions, we look for authors who have a connection to the work. That's a given. We spend a fair amount of time researching this, and we also receive input from the author's Estate from whom we also require approval. Of primary importance is, how is this author connected to the work. This is not the introduction-version of a remarque by an artist who has absolutely nothing to do with the book. I agree, that would not make sense.

    Which reminds me that I would love to read Joe Hill's introduction :s
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phalucha View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zelig View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Phalucha View Post
    I am of the view that introductions and afterwords by random people however well known or creative in their own right are meaningless.
    As a point of clarification, are you making a general statement, or are you suggesting that we select intro authors at random, based primarily on how big a name they are, as opposed to their connection to the novel? As you mentioned Polanski, Iím assuming your statement was not of a general nature, and specific to this book, but I wanted to clarify.
    General statement Paul. I have no insights on your selection process and definitely not suggesting you chase big names. I use Polanski as an example of someone that has a clear and indisputable connection To Rosemaryís Baby and whoís views and signature would enhance the value of the book. At least for me.
    Isn't Polanski considered a fugitive? I think I would pass on that unless the money went to his victim.

  7. #5207
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    Yeah, he skipped the country after pleading guilty to raping a 13 year old. I wouldn't have it in my house.
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  8. #5208
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    Agreed, there is a big controversy now about him.
    He even got "fired" from the Oscars academy.

    Same with Woody Allen who cannot find any publisher for his memoirs just now.

    Or... Morgan Freeman, which was accused of sexual harassment by 8 women and alledgly had an affair with his grand daughter if I remember correctly...
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  9. #5209
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    Quote Originally Posted by Munnecom View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by zelig View Post
    Signatures are something else I could discuss at length, but that's for another time.
    Please do, Iíd love to hear your thoughts.

    I like signed books, but ultimately, signatures - even from the author - are low on my list of things I want from fine-press books. A quality binding, some kind of slip- or traycase, paper and printing quality, illustrations and trim size are all more important to me.
    Well, okay. Since you asked.

    From my standpoint as the publisher, here are some thoughts on signatures.

    There is that old nugget of a comment I see from time to time berating the price of a book, followed up by ď...and it isnít even signed.Ē

    In general, signature does not play any part in establishing the retail price of an edition. I have data points for every tangible element making up the cost of production, and signature isnít one of them. Price is based entirely on production cost. One exception is when an author requires a signing fee over and above royalties, then that cost is spread out across all copies, and it's minimal. So for me, to equate the price of a book to whether it is signed or not, well it isn't something I can wrap my mind around.

    Again, publisher's perspective for a newly released edition, sold direct from the publisher and not aftermarket.

    Something that comes to mind is a book I have scheduled where the author is deceased, but we have a famous author signing because there will be an introduction by that author. The price remains the same. It isn't marked up simply because it has that signature.

    What this sort of comment tells me is that when someone decides to not purchase one of my books because it does not have a signature, and perhaps in particular, the author's signature, then they are passing for the wrong reasons. At least, what I personally consider to be the wrong reasons. For the non-buyer, their reasoning is valid for them, and I respect that.

    I would expect people to buy my books for the love of the story, for the love of the author and of course for the love of the physical production of it; and not whether it is signed. I guess my books are for book lovers, not signature lovers.

    Having said that, as a collector I understand how signature is important for several reasons. Itís when looking at a price and then trying to justify that price based on whether itís signed or not, that doesnít make sense to me in the context of the books I publish.

    Does that mean I won't seek out signatures? I think you know the answer to that. Signatures are pursued for every edition.

    So what would be the 'right' reason to pass on an edition? Sometimes I will see a comment about how a person doesn't like the design of the book. Of course, that hardly ever happens... tsk tsk... big-smiley-face... but if you pass for that reason, to me, you are actually passing for one of the right reasons. You simply don't like the design.

    Iím in the business of making what I would hope people consider to be beautiful books, first. Signatures, although important, are secondary.

  10. #5210
    Gunslinger Apprentice Munnecom has a spectacular aura about Munnecom has a spectacular aura about

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    Thanks for that! I thought signing fees were standard practice.

  11. #5211
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    That is what I figured Paul. Personally, I love the designs of the books. I am still extremely impressed on how you incorporate the story in the design. Sigs are nice but they are not why I buy the books. I buy the books because of your design and it's a story that I have not read yet and want the book for that reason. You explanation was really good. I am really excited to see what books are in the pipeline.
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  12. #5212
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    Thanks for the info and insight into the process, Paul. So far, I've been nothing but impressed with your design decisions. I've heard some objections from others and while I see their points, I don't agree. It's been kind of mind-blowing for me that you're doing exactly the kinds of books I'd want exactly the way I'd want them done. It sounds like I'm brown-nosing here, but it's true.

    On signatures, I would pay more for a signature. I was furious that I missed out on the signed Misery. In part for the quality of that edition, but also because King signed it. Signatures make the book feel more complete. For deceased authors, well some are just completely dead and there's no way around that. And unless someone is wiling to lug them up to the Micmac burial grounds, we can forget about getting a signature. I'm not going to do that. Who is? Even if we did, then I'm not sure the deceased author would be in the mood to sign anything. They just don't come back the same. In that case, I've been impressed with who you have lined up to sign your editions. As long as that the signatory (is that the right usage of that word?? it's not an agreement, it's a book) writes an intro or an afterword making a case or a statement on the book, I'll be satisfied. The closer that person is to the work, the better (of course).

  13. #5213
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    Although I donít value signatures enough to seek them out (Iím big on materials and features), I would still expect the presence of one to play a big role in determining retail price, given that it adds value in the eyes of so many buyers.

    If Suntup doesnít mark up due to the presence of a signature, thatís certainly cool, but as someone who wants small/specialty publishers to thrive and survive, I kind of want them to do that, given how much of their business model is strange and unreliable (Cemetery Danceís recent tango with insolvent printers comes to mind).
    I literally have no idea what I'm doing.

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    I know adding positive Reputation doesn't really mean anything in the grand scheme of the board (unless there is an endgame I'm unaware of where the person with the highest positive rep takes over the entire chocolate factory), but there are days I wish I could just add Positive rep right away again and again when someone is killing it in multiple posts in a thread like this.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian James Freeman View Post
    I know adding positive Reputation doesn't really mean anything in the grand scheme of the board (unless there is an endgame I'm unaware of where the person with the highest positive rep takes over the entire chocolate factory), but there are days I wish I could just add Positive rep right away again and again when someone is killing it in multiple posts in a thread like this.
    Same happens to me. Most of the times I can't give more + rep due to limits.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ari_Racing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian James Freeman View Post
    I know adding positive Reputation doesn't really mean anything in the grand scheme of the board (unless there is an endgame I'm unaware of where the person with the highest positive rep takes over the entire chocolate factory), but there are days I wish I could just add Positive rep right away again and again when someone is killing it in multiple posts in a thread like this.
    Same happens to me. Most of the times I can't give more + rep due to limits.
    Send me some $$ via Paypal and I'll rep who you want repped. Unless, of course, I've already repped him.

  18. #5218
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ari_Racing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian James Freeman View Post
    I know adding positive Reputation doesn't really mean anything in the grand scheme of the board (unless there is an endgame I'm unaware of where the person with the highest positive rep takes over the entire chocolate factory), but there are days I wish I could just add Positive rep right away again and again when someone is killing it in multiple posts in a thread like this.
    Same happens to me. Most of the times I can't give more + rep due to limits.
    I know the feeling

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian James Freeman View Post
    unless there is an endgame I'm unaware of
    When Paul snaps his fingers, half the books he's published so far will turn to dust...

  20. #5220
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian James Freeman View Post
    I know adding positive Reputation doesn't really mean anything in the grand scheme of the board (unless there is an endgame I'm unaware of where the person with the highest positive rep takes over the entire chocolate factory), but there are days I wish I could just add Positive rep right away again and again when someone is killing it in multiple posts in a thread like this.
    You can always PM me and I'll give the rep and attribute it to you.

  21. #5221

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    Quote Originally Posted by Munnecom View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian James Freeman View Post
    unless there is an endgame I'm unaware of
    When Paul snaps his fingers, half the books he's published so far will turn to dust...
    That's why you need to buy TWO copies!
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  22. #5222
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian James Freeman View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Munnecom View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian James Freeman View Post
    unless there is an endgame I'm unaware of
    When Paul snaps his fingers, half the books he's published so far will turn to dust...
    That's why you need to buy TWO copies!
    Or rather, "That's why I needed to buy TWO copies, honey!"

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  23. #5223
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    Thanks for asking a great question, Bill. Youíve sparked a lot of good discussion.

    Personally I like when authors of an introduction, a foreword, and/or an afterward sign a book - regardless of why or even whether they are well-known. If someone contributed to the edition in any manner, then their autograph adds a personal touch.
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