+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 87

Thread: Hax (and the other names)

  1. #1
    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Hungary (till I move to Fatu Hiva with Brice)
    Posts
    9,068
    Country
    Country Flag

    :?: Hax (and the other names)

    Why the blue hell did Roland cry out the name of the cook, Hax at the Tower? He cried out his friends' his mates' and his loves' names... why was Hax there?

    Roland would have understood.

  2. #2
    The Tenant Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Chinatown
    Posts
    22,486
    Country
    Country Flag

    Default

    I never could understand how that list was made (I started a thread on that at .net, and there have been a few theories, none of them 100% satisfactory). One thing I can say for Hax is that he was definitely one of those who died on Roland's way to the Tower.

    Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
    When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)

    bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  3. #3
    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Hungary (till I move to Fatu Hiva with Brice)
    Posts
    9,068
    Country
    Country Flag

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jean View Post
    I never could understand how that list was made (I started a thread on that at .net, and there have been a few theories, none of them 100% satisfactory). One thing I can say for Hax is that he was definitely one of those who died on Roland's way to the Tower.
    So did Mordred. And he wasn't in the list.

    Roland would have understood.

  4. #4
    Along the Path of the Beam Will is on a distinguished road Will's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    AL
    Posts
    44

    Default

    I'm pretty rusty on my DT, but wasn't Hax's death a big milestone for Roland, loss-of-innocence type thing? That might default him onto the VIP list.

    My answer to Mordred is that he sucked. If some cannibalistic demon-spider offspring came at me and my friends, I'd be like "Screw that guy."
    People said I was dumb, but I proved them.

  5. #5
    Roont Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Lettiland
    Posts
    22,328
    My Mood
    Aggressive
    Country
    Country Flag

    Default

    I think maybe in some ways Hax set him on his path at least in his mind. Plus he did seem to have some fondness for him despite the need to turn him in for his betrayal.
    The Awesomest fled across the desert and The Awesomer followed.

    If you rescue me
    Iíll be your friend forever


    I wish that I could write fiction, but that seems almost an impossibility. -howard phillips lovecraft (1915)



  6. #6
    Big Coffin Hunter jayson is on a distinguished road

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    10,971

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brice View Post
    I think maybe in some ways Hax set him on his path at least in his mind. Plus he did seem to have some fondness for him despite the need to turn him in for his betrayal.
    I think this was in many ways Roland's first real step towards the Tower. Hax was the first person Roland "killed" for he knew what end would come of his telling. At that young age, Roland chose to actively participate in the wars of his father(s). The crying I think showed that despite this adult choice, he was still very much a boy.

  7. #7
    Roont Matt will become famous soon enough Matt's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Parachute, Colorado
    Posts
    15,112
    My Mood
    Psychedelic
    Country
    Country Flag
    Gender
    Gender

    Default

    I agree, perhaps he felt a bit guilty for squealing on Hax even after all those years.

    Also interesting about that is Roland must call Hax's name every time he gets there because the event is so early in his ultimate quest.
    The kindness of close friends is like a warm blanket

  8. #8
    The Tenant Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Chinatown
    Posts
    22,486
    Country
    Country Flag

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt View Post
    Also interesting about that is Roland must call Hax's name every time he gets there because the event is so early in his ultimate quest.
    !!!

    Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
    When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)

    bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  9. #9
    DT.Org's Official Sweetie Wuducynn will become famous soon enough Wuducynn's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    6,451
    Gender
    Gender

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt View Post
    Also interesting about that is Roland must call Hax's name every time he gets there because the event is so early in his ultimate quest.
    Hmmmmmmm, this makes me think.
    "It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.

    "When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah

  10. #10
    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Hungary (till I move to Fatu Hiva with Brice)
    Posts
    9,068
    Country
    Country Flag

    Default

    Or maybe when he was there - at the Dark Tower - he was a little bit like a child in his soul... it was his dream all in his life and in the poem we can read: "Childe Roland To The Dark Tower Came"
    And the child or childe soul of Roland still loved Hax.
    Just a thought...

    Roland would have understood.

  11. #11
    The Tenant Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Chinatown
    Posts
    22,486
    Country
    Country Flag

    Default

    it's a good thought, but I'm afraid "childe" means just a descendant of noble family, as (another example) in Byron's Childe Harold. They had that "Childe" before their proper name until they at last inherited the title, or before being knighted, or before something else happened, I forget now which - it didn't depend on their actual age anyway.

    Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
    When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)

    bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  12. #12
    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Hungary (till I move to Fatu Hiva with Brice)
    Posts
    9,068
    Country
    Country Flag

    Default

    You must be right, Jean - you know much more than me but as I have read altought childe doesn't mean a child it does mean a young man.

    Roland would have understood.

  13. #13
    The Tenant Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Chinatown
    Posts
    22,486
    Country
    Country Flag

    Default

    yes, you're right as usual

    Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
    When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)

    bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  14. #14
    damned and saved Letti will become famous soon enough Letti's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Hungary (till I move to Fatu Hiva with Brice)
    Posts
    9,068
    Country
    Country Flag

    Default

    But a young man is not a child... so thank you, Jean for the correction.

    Roland would have understood.

  15. #15
    Roont Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Lettiland
    Posts
    22,328
    My Mood
    Aggressive
    Country
    Country Flag

    Default

    Sometimes a child can be a young man. Maybe you are both partially right.
    The Awesomest fled across the desert and The Awesomer followed.

    If you rescue me
    Iíll be your friend forever


    I wish that I could write fiction, but that seems almost an impossibility. -howard phillips lovecraft (1915)



  16. #16
    Numenorean ManOfWesternesse is on a distinguished road ManOfWesternesse's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Sligo. Ireland.
    Posts
    2,244
    Country
    Country Flag
    Gender
    Gender

    Default

    I have to admit that it annoys me greatly that Roland should sing the name of Hax at the Tower, and sing it in the company of all those names deserving of being sung there.
    The young, un-tried, Roland liked the cook for simple childish reasons at one time, but the Roland who reached the Tower knew him for the traitor he was. He always made a great deal about the fact that he would sing names at the Tower "... there I will sing their names..." , that it seems an insult to them to sing Hax's name in their midst - never mind the insult to those who's names are not sung, but might have been...

    I have wondered if this was just an oversight by king, but it seems unlikely - so it would be interesting to hear his reasoning on it...
    <img src=http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z47/ManOfWesternesse/dt_bcBanner002d.jpg border=0 alt= />

  17. #17
    Big Coffin Hunter jayson is on a distinguished road

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    10,971

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ManOfWesternesse View Post
    I have to admit that it annoys me greatly that Roland should sing the name of Hax at the Tower, and sing it in the company of all those names deserving of being sung there.
    The young, un-tried, Roland liked the cook for simple childish reasons at one time, but the Roland who reached the Tower knew him for the traitor he was. He always made a great deal about the fact that he would sing names at the Tower "... there I will sing their names..." , that it seems an insult to them to sing Hax's name in their midst - never mind the insult to those who's names are not sung, but might have been...

    I have wondered if this was just an oversight by king, but it seems unlikely - so it would be interesting to hear his reasoning on it...
    I still think it is Roland not honoring Hax the person, but his own decision to turn in Hax as the "official" beginning of his road to the Tower. I don't think Roland was equating Hax with the others who helped him on his road, but just naming Hax as his first kill on this road.

  18. #18
    Numenorean ManOfWesternesse is on a distinguished road ManOfWesternesse's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Sligo. Ireland.
    Posts
    2,244
    Country
    Country Flag
    Gender
    Gender

    Default

    I do see your point R_of_G, and had seen your post before I posted above, but (cry-yer-pardon) I just don't agree.
    What was Hax? - an employee of the Court in Gilead who turned traitor for The Good Man. He was to be a link in a delivery chain that would have brought poisoned meat to be eaten by free men,women and children of ... where was it... not Gilead itself but a nearby village??
    OK he was 'significant' to Roland because of the act of turning him in for certain hanging, and we get an insight into that by the way Steven Deschain reacts to Roland's decision to report him, and his desire to know Roland's reasons...

    ... but why would any of this make him so significant on Rolands path to the Tower that he should sing his name before the Tower? (I take this singing of names before the Tower very seriously - in case it had escaped yer attention )
    ...maybe I'm missing a point somewhere...?
    <img src=http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z47/ManOfWesternesse/dt_bcBanner002d.jpg border=0 alt= />

  19. #19
    Big Coffin Hunter jayson is on a distinguished road

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    10,971

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ManOfWesternesse View Post
    What was Hax?
    Like I said, I tend to think Roland sees Hax as the first real step on his path. As the first death Roland was responsible for causing, I think he knows that in many ways his childhood ended that day, not the day he bested Cort, or the day he rode for Mejis. That day he became more the son of Stephen Deschain than he could just by being an apprentice gunslinger. By turning in Hax, Roland declared his fathers' enemies his own and began his lieflong quest. I think the crying of Hax's name is Roland acknowledging his first kill in the name of the Tower.

    Either that or he was so tired when he got there that he forgot who was who but he once knew someone named Hax so out the name came... lol

    Seriously though, because it disturbed me at first that Hax' name was spoken along with the others so I did a lot of thinking on why Roland says it. The above is the most plausible theory I've come up with. Surely Roland didn't forgive Hax and equate him with the others because if he did I wonder if the Tower door ever would have opened to him.

  20. #20
    Roont Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice has much to be proud of Brice's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Lettiland
    Posts
    22,328
    My Mood
    Aggressive
    Country
    Country Flag

    Default

    Or if maybe it would have opened putting him at the beginning of another loop, maybe?
    The Awesomest fled across the desert and The Awesomer followed.

    If you rescue me
    Iíll be your friend forever


    I wish that I could write fiction, but that seems almost an impossibility. -howard phillips lovecraft (1915)



  21. #21
    Roont Matt will become famous soon enough Matt's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Parachute, Colorado
    Posts
    15,112
    My Mood
    Psychedelic
    Country
    Country Flag
    Gender
    Gender

    Default

    I think he called the names of the people he felt like he "ran over" to get to the Tower and somewhere in his mind he felt that way about Hax.

    I mean, Roland told on him and they hung his ass. That is got to stay with you no matter how bad a guy Hax was.
    The kindness of close friends is like a warm blanket

  22. #22
    Numenorean ManOfWesternesse is on a distinguished road ManOfWesternesse's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Sligo. Ireland.
    Posts
    2,244
    Country
    Country Flag
    Gender
    Gender

    Default

    I dunno - it still does'nt hang well with me.
    It does not fit with the same logic as the other names he sings there (I'd have to go look at the book to see them all - but I'm pretty sure Hax is the odd-one-out by a country mile!)
    <img src=http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z47/ManOfWesternesse/dt_bcBanner002d.jpg border=0 alt= />

  23. #23
    The Tenant Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean has much to be proud of Jean's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Chinatown
    Posts
    22,486
    Country
    Country Flag

    Default

    there's hardly any "same logic" that would cover all of those names

    I agree with Matt; moreover, for me Hax is one of the most prominent victims of the events. He is epitomy of betrayal - which something that will always accompany Roland on his way towards the Dark Tower - but he is also someone who, like so many, will fall under the axe wielded by the forces too big for him to comprehend (Roland, by the way, being one of those forces, although he can hardly comprehend them at that moment). No, I don't really know why Hax was there, but I always felt it was right; it just rang true to me.

    Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
    When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)

    bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  24. #24
    Constant Reader Darkthoughts has a spectacular aura about Darkthoughts has a spectacular aura about Darkthoughts has a spectacular aura about Darkthoughts's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    9,302
    My Mood
    Cynical
    Country
    Country Flag
    Gender
    Gender

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ManOfWesternesse View Post
    I dunno - it still does'nt hang well with me.
    Was that a deliberate pun?

  25. #25
    Numenorean ManOfWesternesse is on a distinguished road ManOfWesternesse's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Sligo. Ireland.
    Posts
    2,244
    Country
    Country Flag
    Gender
    Gender

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Darkthoughts View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ManOfWesternesse View Post
    I dunno - it still does'nt hang well with me.
    Was that a deliberate pun?
    No! - I had'nt noticed! Good spot!
    <img src=http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z47/ManOfWesternesse/dt_bcBanner002d.jpg border=0 alt= />

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts