He would have finished for sure.
He would have finished for sure.
"The Constitution shall never be construed....to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms" (Samuel Adams, Debates and Proceedings in the Convention of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, 86-87)
as you know, I love the last volumes, butSpoiler:
Please understand me right, I loved the character, and I didn't mind him being introduced, just like I didn't mind Flagg's backstory in general; it's the hurried, eleventh-hourish way both were done that surprized me. Key element coming unprepared doesn't feel very King, at least not to me; nor does the underbaked backstory of a villain who has been with us for so long.
Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)
bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
*cough* Deus Ex-machina *end-cough*
"It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.
"When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah
no, I don't believe it was the case. I see it quite differently: not something that came to the author's rescue when he didn't know what to do, but something necessary, intrinsic to the story, something about which he perfectly knew what and why and how it was, but for some reason didn't get around to developing properly. It may have been laziness, neglect, fear of death, but not Deus ex machina.
Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)
bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It fits a lot better when you read Insomnia. Its one of the many things that happen to help Roland in his quest. Also, I think it shows that Roland was wrong about Insomnia being "tricksy" or however he put it.
"It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.
"When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah
It didn't have a hurried feel to me, the story itself was rushing along with the last two books. But it doesn't feel to me like he was rushing writing it.
"It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.
"When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah
I hadn't met Patrick before so maybe that's why I didn't feel that part "rushed".
Roland would have understood.
You really ought to read Insomnia Letti dearest.
"It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.
"When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah
I was expecting this Insomnia argument... but it's again mythos vs. book, like that old comics controversy. I see the Dark Tower primarily as a novel consisting of 7 volumes, and such additional bells and whistles as other books as at best secondary. (the same is true when other books are considered; primarily, each of them must have a value of its own)
Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)
bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
*sigh*
"It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.
"When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah
definitely so, but let's talk percentage.Spoiler:
And it's not how King normally work! He always prepares important things in advance, approaching, retreating, developing, narrowing circles around them
Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)
bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I can't think of anything that would be on the same scale.
Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)
bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)
bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.
"When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah
I think a better term than rushed is shallow. The last three books do not have the depth of the first four, IMHO.
It's stressful being an other. ~ Juliet
I believe there ought to be a Constitutional Amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter. ~ Crash Davis
I really want to agree with you, Jean, but don't forget that
Spoiler:
In my copy (Grant, hardcover, 2004), the note is on page 680. I've always found Patrick's entry to feel a bit forced (insert obligatory vulgar joke here), as well as the note to explain it
Spoiler:
So I think it was deus ex machina, but I also think it works, albeit awkwardly, in the established context of the saga.
Last edited by Woofer; 01-15-2008 at 07:42 PM. Reason: Err... forgot the actual quote.
It'll take a lot more than words and guns,
A whole lot more than riches and muscle.
The hands of the many must join as one.
And together we'll cross the river.
Puscifer, "The Humbling River"
Why I did that *cough* *end-cough* was because Jean and I have had an extensive chat already about the deus ex-machina thing..
"It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.
"When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah
"It's his eyes, Roland thought. They were wide and terrible, the eyes of a dragon in human form" - Roland seeing the Crimson King for the first time.
"When the King comes and the Tower falls, sai, all such pretty things as yours will be broken. Then there will be darkness and nothing but the howl of Discordia and the cries of the can toi" - From Song of Susannah
Ah, I thought you were just pointing us to the note.AHTKC wrote: Why I did that *cough* *end-cough* was because Jean and I have had an extensive chat already about the deus ex-machina thing..
Last edited by Woofer; 01-15-2008 at 08:57 PM. Reason: Added quote/context.
It'll take a lot more than words and guns,
A whole lot more than riches and muscle.
The hands of the many must join as one.
And together we'll cross the river.
Puscifer, "The Humbling River"
This is where the rushed part comes in for me. As Jean mentioned, we only have about 100 pages before "the moment". Letti's right, that's nothing to sneeze at; however, it does seem rushed in relation to the magnitude of the role he plays in the end (IMO, of course). As the range of responses indicates, we're not all getting quite the same feel for it. And frankly, I can't say it will "feel" the same the next time I read it.
Phew! Hope that's clear. Crash time!
It'll take a lot more than words and guns,
A whole lot more than riches and muscle.
The hands of the many must join as one.
And together we'll cross the river.
Puscifer, "The Humbling River"
Woofer: the extended discussion of Deus ex machina AllHail is referring to took place in this thread
as far as those 100 pages are concerned, it isn't even the quantity, it's the quality - I don't mean the quality of writing, but the composition. It's all straightforward, without any intrigue,Spoiler:
He is merely, purely, undilutedly instrumental, and that's what Kings normally wouldn't do when the instrument in question is intended to perform a task of such magnitude.
Ask not what bears can do for you, but what you can do for bears. (razz)
When one is in agreement with bears one is always correct. (mae)
bears are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!