What do you think about Jake's parents?
Somehow I liked them a lot. I think they have never understood Jake but I think they loved him a lot but they weren't able to show him their feelings.
I wish we knew more about Jake's mother.
I thought his dad was a total jerk, and his mother was too self-absorbed. I was really rooting for Jake to
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Originally Posted by
Daghain
I thought his dad was a total jerk, and his mother was too self-absorbed. I was really rooting for Jake to
ditto
I know very well that they weren't good parents.. but still I felt sorry for them.
You have a far bigger heart than I. Letti. That's why I like you. :)
Oh no... I don't think so but thank you for your kind words.
I just see my parents in them I think... I mean I was quite a strange kid myself and they didn't really understand me. They tried their best and they gave me so much but they never knew me. I love and I respect them a lot and now I know I should have told them a lot of things I shouldn't have been so closed I didn't dare to talk about... and damn I was a kid. They should have found the way to me.
But I think I have the best parents all over the world but they are humans as well with lots of mistakes.
Maybe that's why I felt sorry for Jake's parents. I don't know.
I loathed Jake's parents. I felt like King did too. Jake was the product of two selfish, self-absorbed people who didn't give a good god-damn about their child. Luckily they were rich, so they could hire someone to care.
As for him being better off with Roland, I suppose, maybe, but he was still an afterthought...the tower was more important to Roland than Jake.
I almost think that's why Jake had Oy. He had to have someone who gave him unconditional love, and that's the void Oy help fill. He knew Jake needed that.
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Originally Posted by
Jean
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Originally Posted by
Daghain
I thought his dad was a total jerk, and his mother was too self-absorbed. I was really rooting for Jake to
ditto
Double ditto and three quarters..
Yep, they were total self obsessed arses and I think after Jake's disappearance they would easily let their sorrow become self pity and thus give themselves (in their own minds) more justification for drinking, snorting and sleeping around.
For your pov Letti, I'd agree that they probably had unhappy lives themselves to feel unable and unaware of how to support and nuture their own child, and thats always sad.
Agreed Darkthoughts, I would think they would just delve deeper into depression and use more drugs as a result.
XIX
Sure thing Chassit - King really has a knack of observing that side of life in his books.
There is a problem when your house keeper knows whats going on in your kids life more then you do. His da had way to many problems and was a workaholic but with his job i wanted to know who keeps a Kruger in a desk? and as for his mum shes pliable she bends to the stronger so shes praticlly useless for anything
Reminded me of mine. Except we were broke.
I hope Black 13 sent Jake's parents into eternal todash. Hated them.
The 2 characters were well used by King in the Book.
Typical of a certain kind of parent in real life nowadays. They had too much happening in their own lives to be seriously interested in Jake's day-to-day life.
But yes, there were certainly indications that they loved him, in their own way, and were concerned about him. They were just too inneffective to do anything meaningful about it.
My overall feelings for them & their loss of jake?
Indifference, I guess...
Count me into the "despised them" camp. I've said before that Jake Chambers is possibly my fav fictional character, certainly my fav character in DT. A good deal of that is because I see a lot of my own childhood in Jake's, with one exception, I had great parents. As far as the strangeness and the loneliness and the lack of real friends, that seemed very familiar to me, but the parents, that's where I really felt terribly for Jake. I don't doubt that Jake's parents did love him on some level, but they'd have been wise to make sure he knew that they did. I didn't talk to my parents a lot when I was his age but I always knew if I absolutely had to, I could and I didn't have to fear them as Jake did his father.
Sadly this is what some people whould actually do.....pathetic isnt it?
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Originally Posted by
Darkthoughts
Yep, they were total self obsessed arses and I think after Jake's disappearance they would easily let their sorrow become self pity and thus give themselves (in their own minds) more justification for drinking, snorting and sleeping around.
For your pov Letti, I'd agree that they probably had unhappy lives themselves to feel unable and unaware of how to support and nuture their own child, and thats always sad.
Its funny, because I can usually identify with parents of all shapes and sizes.
I remember reading these two and thinking there was no way I could identify with any part of either of them.
they always seemed to me a little exaggerated as characters. As if Mr.King decided to make his own task easier, not making Jake face the horrible choice between the world behind the door and normal parents.
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Originally Posted by
Jean
they always seemed to me a little exaggerated as characters. As if Mr.King decided to make his own task easier, not making Jake face the horrible choice between the world behind the door and normal parents.
I must disagree, Jean.
First of all I don't think that King is that type of author who chooses the easier way... no, I don't think so. He writes what he must write. Even if it made Jake's choice easier (I am not sure about it at all) that's how it had to be.
- Anyway if you look at the psychological part of it usually the kids who are treated badly by their parents (even if they are hit or even worse) love and are hooked on their parents much more than the well-treated ones. It's a fact. -
Secondly, what do you mean by normal parents?? Most of the parents (if not all) make lots of mistakes and many of them are big. I do love my parents and I respect them but when I look back... they could make horrible things.
So for me Jake's parents are absolutely normal. I might live in a darker world but they are. They didn't hit him to coma they gave him food they loved him but they couldn't show it... so in my eyes they weren't mosters at all and they were absolutely normal. Not good. Not at all. But normal.
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Originally Posted by
Letti
Anyway if you look at the psychological part of it usually the kids who are treated badly by their parents (even if they are hit or even worse) love and are hooked on their parents much more than the well-treated ones. It's a fact. -
I wouldn't say deprived/abused kids love their parents more than well treated kids, but I'm sure they crave normal love more, as a result of not receiving it.
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So for me Jake's parents are absolutely normal. I might live in a darker world but they are. They didn't hit him to coma they gave him food they loved him but they couldn't show it... so in my eyes they weren't mosters at all and they were absolutely normal. Not good. Not at all. But normal.
I see what you're saying, sure they didn't physically abuse him, but they neglected him emotionally. I don't think they were monsters either, but they weren't normal parents in my eyes, they were too self involved - I consider normal to be a parent who was able to put his/her child's needs before that of their own the majority of the time.
I don't think normal is perhaps the best word, its very PC but my Dad and his other social worker colleagues use the term "good enough parent" instead of normal and abnormal - I guess it casts less aspersions, but I think the PC term is, for once, better in this context :)
Dark, that's a good distinction with the PC thing.
I certainly would not call Jakes parents 'normal' either - it just would'nt ring true for me - but 'good enough' ? Maybe...
I see where Letti's coming from though - these 2 did not wrong Jake in any way by intent, but purely by neglect (not any physical neglect no, but emotional yes). They were not 'bad' parents, certainly not 'great' ones, and for me they probably fall a bit short of 'good' too.
Lisa & Brian, I am with you both. "Normal" can be a bit subjective. Neglectful and self-absorbed would be accurate descriptors. Those are not qualities that make for good parents, but I agree that they never intentionally hurt Jake. I think they were a bit too self-absorbed to realize they were doing anything "wrong."
Yes, for me they were people that probably had a child because it was part of what they thought you should do, rather than considering if they actually wanted to, or if they had the time and emotional stability it takes to be a parent.
I agree completely. Jake was more of an accessory than a human being to them.
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Originally Posted by
Darkthoughts
Yes, for me they were people that probably had a child because it was part of what they thought you should do, rather than considering if they actually wanted to, or if they had the time and emotional stability it takes to be a parent.
yes. I so agree with you. Jake's parents seemed like the type of people who were struggling with their own demons. They tried in their own way to take care of Jake (Gretta Shaw), but were too absorbed in their own shit to really be good parents. I think that if they sobered up and got their own shit together and divorced they may have been more aware of Jake and what was happening to him.
The thing is, it was the 70's. You gotta keep that in mind, too, imo.
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Originally Posted by
Malficeus
but with his job i wanted to know who keeps a Kruger in a desk?
What does his job have to do with that?
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Originally Posted by
All_Hail_The_Crimson_King
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Originally Posted by
Malficeus
but with his job i wanted to know who keeps a Kruger in a desk?
What does his job have to do with that?
Exactly. He kept a Ruger in his desk likely bc he lived in Manhattan.
Jake was a child to them.
Something that happened and they had to care for it as best they could.
As with all of us - we do the best with what we are given.
Jake's father put him in the best of schools and hired the best of nannies for him. He cared for him as best he could.
Is he the perfect daddy?
Is any one?
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Originally Posted by
Childe 007
Jake was a child to them.
Jake's father put him in the best of schools and hired the best of nannies for him. He cared for him as best he could.
The first & second sentences there don't fit too well together for me, say sorry.
Yes, his parents were rich.
They paid for him to go to a good school.
They paid for a good nanny/housekeeper to care for him.
Does that = "He cared for him as best he could."?? Not really to my mind - they needed to give a bit of themselves to him - not just their money.
Not that they mistreated him or anything, as I said before - just that they neglected him, imho.
Paying for expensive schools and nannies is not parenting. It's a more civil form of neglect.
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Originally Posted by
R_of_G
Paying for expensive schools and nannies is not parenting. It's a more civil form of neglect.
Even negative feedback is better than no feedback at all for children.
Jake's mother was a hamster and his father smelt of elderberries!
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Originally Posted by
ManOfWesternesse
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Originally Posted by
Childe 007
Jake was a child to them.
Jake's father put him in the best of schools and hired the best of nannies for him. He cared for him as best he could.
The first & second sentences there don't fit too well together for me, say sorry.
Yes, his parents were rich.
They paid for him to go to a good school.
They paid for a good nanny/housekeeper to care for him.
Does that = "He cared for him as best he could."?? Not really to my mind - they needed to give a bit of themselves to him - not just their money.
How true.
Altought I don't think that Jake's parents were so horrible I must say with the nanny they were just lucky. I can't imagine that they were looking for a good nanny for long. They chose one and thank God she was a good-hearted one.
About the school.. Jake had to go to the best school to prove his parents that what they were doing was good and not selfish.
"Look, my son goes to the best school of the country. That's why I work. (Not because I am hungry for money, nono.) I work because my son desveres the best."
I think you get what I mean.
So with the nanny and the school they didn't do anything.
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Originally Posted by
Letti
About the school.. Jake had to go to the best school to prove his parents that what they were doing was good and not selfish.
"Look, my son goes to the best school of the country. That's why I work. (Not because I am hungry for money, nono.) I work because my son desveres the best."
I saw it more as a status thing with the Chambers and Piper. I'm not saying Elmer didn't think going to Piper would be good for Jake's future, but to me it seemed more like he sent him there because that's where the son of a man as important as Elmer was "supposed" to go to school.
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Originally Posted by
LadyHitchhiker
Jake's mother was a hamster and his father smelt of elderberries!
Thanks for the free laugh! Great reference.
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Originally Posted by
R_of_G
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Originally Posted by
LadyHitchhiker
Jake's mother was a hamster and his father smelt of elderberries!
Thanks for the free laugh! Great reference.
Yes, but it would have been prudent to fart in their general direction whilst saying it! :lol:
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Originally Posted by
ManOfWesternesse
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Originally Posted by
R_of_G
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Originally Posted by
LadyHitchhiker
Jake's mother was a hamster and his father smelt of elderberries!
Thanks for the free laugh! Great reference.
Yes, but it would have been prudent to fart in their general direction whilst saying it! :lol:
You are nothing but a silly english k-n-n-n-nn-igget!
I didn't like them a bit, but I think they were a big part of the way the kid turned out, which I did like.
Therefore, I fell the were a nessacary evil.
I didn't think much of Jake's parents. I don't think that Jake had the worst parents in the world. There simply was no bonding between the parents and the child. That was was the message that I think King was trying to make. I know that Jake was sad about this and as reader that made your heart ache for him...this is what made US BOND with Jake. ( at least this is what made my heart open to him ) I think that the lack of bonding was written to show that your family is not always your true family...that there are bonds that are more powerful than the what most of consider the most solid bonds( like blood relatives )
Jake was not destined to stay with his parents.
....Jake was supposed to be with Roland, Eddie, Susan and OY...
Oy was Jake's truest bond...Oy was Jake's most cherished love...OY loved Jake like he deserved to be loved...and jake loved him...
A boy and his dog to 100000000000000000X.
KIT
Kithereal, that's a very good take on it, that it was about the lack of bonding between Jake and the Chambers. I had not thought of it like that, but it makes perfect sense.