Darkle and tinct and the purpose of the quest *spoilers*

What does the entity speaking to Roland mean that he Darkles and Tincs.
I never got this impression of Roland during the entire series.
Isn't this the "coloring of dreams"?

Does he have some power over his reality.

For example Pere Calahan tells of his conversation with the man in black. How he was offended at the suggestion that the gunslinger might in fact be above KA.
Now I was thinking that the whole point of the quest was some kind of process for Gan/God to regain its sanity. Every time he completes his quest God regains more of his sanity.
The crimson King represents the part of God that allows evil as part of all freewill. While Roland is the part of God that must stop itself from descending into complete chaos and madness. The multiverse becoming more frail over time because God has for whatever reason listened to the darker aspect of its nature.:orely:

Roland serves the Purpose, while The Crimson King serves the Random. Read Stephen King's Insomnia to understand this more.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by getabettereraser

What does the entity speaking to Roland mean that he Darkles and Tincs.
I never got this impression of Roland during the entire series.
Isn't this the "coloring of dreams"?

Does he have some power over his reality.

For example Pere Calahan tells of his conversation with the man in black. How he was offended at the suggestion that the gunslinger might in fact be above KA.
Now I was thinking that the whole point of the quest was some kind of process for Gan/God to regain its sanity. Every time he completes his quest God regains more of his sanity.
The crimson King represents the part of God that allows evil as part of all freewill. While Roland is the part of God that must stop itself from descending into complete chaos and madness. The multiverse becoming more frail over time because God has for whatever reason listened to the darker aspect of its nature.:orely:

---

Roland saving Gan's sanity? That's one of the most interesting interpretations I have ever seen.

I have been reading some of the post and theories from around this forum. Some bordering on a matrix-type simulated worlds.

Another theory I have is a mixture of DT and the Matrix-trilogy. That the door at the top of the tower was a previous dor leading to the Mainframe. Its quite a longshot though...however, world may not be entirely deleted and the contents within can and may continue to exist depite our world perhaps being the current main collective reality.

Whatever the truth it is clear that something or someone holds our world together. It is the central idea Stephen King has used as an inception. The importance of holding the nexus from being destroyed.

Now if it turns out we are in a Matrix-like simulation it might actually explain the intense sense of deja vu a lot of people seem to be experiencing. The Matrix is in dire need of another Neo/Roland character to clean up the system/nexus again.

OR ELSE THE TOWER FALLS AND THINGS WILL GET STRANGER AND MORE ABSURD THAN THEY ALREADY ARE.

Thanks for the reply Letti :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by getabettereraser

THINGS WILL GET STRANGER AND MORE ABSURD THAN THEY ALREADY ARE

---

:lol: I like that. :clap:

Stephen King writes alot about Repetition. So do music artists. Thus that 1408 "I've already done this" theme seems to permeate popular culture. In a Matrix like reality that revolves around a couple of centuries of human history that ensures repetition while a person is still plugged in can gradually become aware and integrate this deja vu into their work. Why bother to place this type of inception into their work.

Or perhaps a sinister Conceptual Entrapment?

I've been going through the Concordance's lately. I have to say I'm a little confused on a couple of things about Walter. We know he's Walter, Marten, Flagg and a bunch of other guys with RF for initials. I thought it was only hinted at in the first book that he's also John Farson, the Good Man, but according the Concorande 1 & 2, Robin Firth says that's Walter as well. I haven't read all of the comics but I read the first few of Gunslinger Born and they had Walter and Farson talking to each other, two different guys. Firth is the one in charge of the comics too. So I don't know if that ever gets resolved. I guess I'll have to read on and find out.

Anyway, I had always assumed that Walter was also the Ageless Stranger? Even though he says something about the ageless stranger being Maerlin, but I was never that one. Or something along those lines. I thought that was just another, titter, fib and he actually was. Is it said in The Stand that Flagg is also called the Ageless Stranger? I thought so but I could be wrong.

What I'm trying to get at is that The Ageless Stranger, The Crimson King, and Roland are the three beings who are mentioned throughout the books who can darkle and tinct. In The Gunslinger it says, He is in all times, right after darkles and tincts. Whenever I've read it I interpreted it as he's been around for a long time and he jumps bodies, like in Insomnia when Ed says that the CK was King Harod way back when, but according to the Concordance, I'm a little off. It says, he lives backward in time and can live simultaneously in all times.

lol. I thought I realized what that meant when I read it earlier but it's escaped me again and I'm off in another direction with it.
Death, but not for you, gunslinger. Never for you.

Ok, Ageless Stranger = Maerlyn = Legion. In The Stand Tom Cullen says Flagg is Legion. Storm of the Century, Linoge is Legion. Needful Things, Gaunt is Legion. I've heard it explained both ways that Legion is actually a group of evil beings and also maybe it's only one. I'm beginning to think it's the later. If it darkles and tincts it can live in all times and move around through the past and all times seamlessly. Also, Walter says in the palaver at Golgatha that Roland would have to face the Ageless Stranger before has to face the Crimson King. It would make more sense if it was just one entity then Roland trying to face off against all these creatures. Would it be all at once or does he have to go from place to place trying to find more members of Legion? lol.

I really need to get a life.

The Ageless Stranger is Flagg (Walter, TMIB -- the man in black). He referred to himself by that title & said his name was Legion 'cause he wanted to try to scare off Roland, but not let on that he meant himself and get shot then and there. Legion probably does apply to more than one guy, though; I don't think that TMIB is the same person as Linoge or Gaunt.

Also, Maerlyn is someone else, though that might have been confused in the original version of DT1.

Roland's guns can't kill Flagg. He emptied both guns at him under the mountain and didn't hit him once. Does that mean Walter is undead, like the CK after swallowing his sharpened spoon?
You kill me no more than you kill yourself.

I got really confused about the CK being possibly all of them. I see flagg martin just being extensions of the Crimson King. Remember in Black House and Talisman it is implyed that twinners exist. Being TransDimensional it is possible the Crimson King brought about the existence of Flagg for the sole purpose of Flagg to follow Roland to the Tower. Kill Roland. And enter the Tower with the Guns of Gilead. The King would then possess Flagg and enter the door at the top. Thee Crimson King grew tired of this loop and created a new shell. Mordred.

Basically Roland would always stop or destroy the Agul Siento. And the Combination would always be liberated by Sawyer. Danville was allowed to live due to his ability to edit physical reality.

Mordred would have given more opportunities and continuation for the Crimson King to try to prevent Agul siento and the combinmation from being destroyed.

The Crimson King went insane because being trapped in the tower he was subject to the "not remembering the future" once Flagg or Roland opened the top door.

The Ageless stranger is God!!!

Only God scares Roland and the Crimson King LOL!!!

The Ageless Stranger is an entity that is seperate from the Crimson King. Even the Dark Tower itself.

Not sure if I have the right words to explain my thoughts on the subjects raised, but here goes. First off, I think you have to acknowledge that the is a distinct and important differece between all the Tower-worlds (TW's) and the Keystone world. My take was always that the creatures/forces that impacted the KW operated primarily in the TW's, which were comprised of all the possible choices for a given decision before someone in the KW. The Random & the Purpose could try to influence choices in the KW, by playing out they're "games"? in the different TW's. However, once a choice was finally made or committed to in the KW, it was "in the books" so to speak, with certain exceptions.

That make any sense? :orely:

As far as "he darkles...he tincs," I think he refers to RF's existence and ability to travel to all worlds, as well as his ever tampering with them. I'm reading the series for the third time and just finished Gunslinger and I'm so surprised by all of the foreshadowing and hints of the greater scheme of things contained in the very first novel. So many nuances, you must read it several times in order to process everything. Note: I'm refering to the first time that phrase is found in the Tower series. This is after Roland finally catches up to the illustrious Man in Black who tells him he must kill one of the Crimson King's minions. He doesn't say exactly who that is, but I believe he refers to the occupant of the Emerald City that lies just beyond the Turnpike. This particular minion is none other than Randall Flagg (who certainly darkles and tincs in many of King's novels).

Also, I think we can add Bob Gray (otherwise know as Pennywise the Dancing Clown) to this list that is "Legion."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by costanza

Ok, Ageless Stranger = Maerlyn = Legion. In The Stand Tom Cullen says Flagg is Legion. Storm of the Century, Linoge is Legion. Needful Things, Gaunt is Legion. I've heard it explained both ways that Legion is actually a group of evil beings and also maybe it's only one. I'm beginning to think it's the later. If it darkles and tincts it can live in all times and move around through the past and all times seamlessly. Also, Walter says in the palaver at Golgatha that Roland would have to face the Ageless Stranger before has to face the Crimson King. It would make more sense if it was just one entity then Roland trying to face off against all these creatures. Would it be all at once or does he have to go from place to place trying to find more members of Legion? lol.


I really need to get a life.

---

M-O-O-N. That spells Legion. :P

I think, he who "Darkles and Tincts" pertains to the Keystone world!!!

Roland, is of course special to ALL worlds!!!!

Where does our world stand in the Hierarchy of worlds in the Dark Tower?
I got this strangest of feelings it's not at the top...:unsure:

I got this strangest of feelings it is sinking lower, wherever it was it started at

"... I got this feeling that it's later than it seems ..."

Time sure does seem really funny.

I mean do any of you get deja vu and then "remember" what you are suppost to do or say at any given moment and then do or say something else? Like second guessing the people around you? I have...and the people seem to frown upon such actions.:nope:

And about it sinking lower. Seems like it is reaching a low ebb. Almost like everyone is collectively trying to reset time to a different year. Like the next worldwide disaster is right around the corner.

Is the universe getting ready to move on?

The year is 2036 lol

My take on Legion: legion is a word, rather than a name. It refers to a group. I think it was used initially just to imply a scary bunch of people, or even erroneously implying a scary person. It was left out of the revised Gunslinger, which is written to match the rest of the series. So Legion is a moot point.

My take on Flagg: he really is a legion of sorts, because he takes the role of many different people. Still, he's just one dude. A powerful dude, but only one guy. He darkles and tincts, in description, because he is magical. He is powerful. He darkles. He tincts. Book 7 explains his role as a seperate entity to CK.