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View Full Version : Journeys End in Lovers Meeting: Great Love Stories as a Byproduct or Side-Effect



Jean
07-22-2007, 11:48 PM
To make my point clearer, I'll begin with subject other than King.

Watching Back To The Future 3 for the umpteenth time, I marveled again at how important and extraordinary and touching the love story was; Doc Brown and Clara flying away on that hoverboard is one of the best graphic symbols of love triumphant I've ever seen. As everyone remembers, the trilogy is not at all about love; Doc and Clara come as additional attraction, but make a perfect romance inside a series whose main emphasis is placed elsewhere; the very way it differs so greatly from all bona fide romances in movies "about love" makes it unforgettable. There are other examples of the same in movies or literature; I think everyone can think of many.

I believe King is a genius of this side-effect romance. The love stories in novels that by themselves have little to do with love - The Stand (Fran and Stuart), It (Ben and Beverly), or The Dark Tower (Eddie and Susannah); or, on a smaller scale, many other similar loves in almost every novel, - all are, to my mind, love-story masterpieces; quite unlike the only time he was actually endeavoring to write a "love story" (the Mejis part of W&G) and came up with a bundle of common places. This last statement of mine is, of course, highly questionable, and I pray if it has to be discussed, let's do it in W&G forum of Mid-World section; here, please, let's concentrate of those love stories by King that make ostensibly secondary part of his novels.

Darkthoughts
07-23-2007, 03:53 AM
Insomnia is one of my favourite King books and consequently I love the relationship between Ralph and Lois in that.
Their romance isn't pivotal to the plot, but it wouldn't be the same if they were simply friends - their love lends something to the storyline, enriches it, encourages you to invest more in the characters...I guess thats the point you were making Jean?

I like the pace and feel of their relationship too - there aren't many books where senior citizens get to take the starring roles and I loved that about Insomnia. It also affected the type of love Ralph and Lois felt for each other. Even though they were still sexually attracted to each other, it wasn't frantic and solely lustful - it was more about caring and wanting to be cared for.

Definately a favourite :)

Letti
07-23-2007, 11:38 AM
I think everything depends on what you mean by such things as "true love" "real love" "deep love". We can talk about what we think about this or that love between these or those people but in fact we will argue about what we think about love.

Darkthoughts
07-24-2007, 12:50 AM
I agree that when you start trying to define love, you can only do so by basing it on personal experience - theres no universal standard for "what love is".

But, for the purposes of this particular thread I just decribed what I liked about Lois and Ralph's relationship being as it was an example of a romance within a non romance story.

Matt
07-24-2007, 06:01 AM
And that may be the key to the discussion we are having. To some of us, the feeling we got from Roland and Susan's love spoke to us as the criteria for the real thing (different for everyone).

In my case, I believe she loved him and was willing to die for him. If sacrificing yourself for someone isn't a measure, I am not sure what is. But again, that is my perspective based on my experience with the phenomenon of love.

I asked Dora, who is a big romance fan (reads a lot of Nora Roberts) how she felt the story of their love stacked up and she conceded that it wasn't quite as good for her as it was for me.

Jean
07-24-2007, 06:09 AM
In my opinion, sacrificing oneself isn't a measure of love. It's only a property of youth. Everywhere in the world young people sacrifice their lives for nothing, - for vague ideas, for abstractions, for a slogan; commit suicides on slightest pretext, - it's easy to die when you're young, and the young die readily; it's one of the sad paradoxes of our life.

And please, let's reserve this thread for love stories which are not the focus of a novel, and discuss everything W&G-connected where it belongs.


Insomnia is one of my favourite King books and consequently I love the relationship between Ralph and Lois in that.
Their romance isn't pivotal to the plot, but it wouldn't be the same if they were simply friends - their love lends something to the storyline, enriches it, encourages you to invest more in the characters...I guess thats the point you were making Jean?
Yes sure... but mainly the other way: how a side-story primarily intended (I think) as a development of characters, or something to enrich the storiline, acquires its own value; how an accomplished love story is born out of what originally was only an addition to the "main" plot.

Matt
07-24-2007, 06:26 AM
Eeeek!! Sorry Jean. Its just my perspective.

I didn't say that all sacrifice means love but to me, it can.

Maybe I just don't understand the discussion

Darkthoughts
07-24-2007, 06:43 AM
What King stories strike you as particular examples of this Jean?

Jean
07-24-2007, 06:50 AM
What King stories strike you as particular examples of this Jean?
The Stand. I read it first as the tale of the end (and beginning) of the world; then as a tale of the dialectic of human soul (especially those mirrored characters, Larry and Harold, one going up and the other down); and finally as love story of Fran and Stuart.

It, of course! Ben and Beverly. This one is my favorite, maybe of all love stories ever written by anybody.

Insomnia, without doubt.

Needful Things: Alan and Polly.

And, to crown it all, The Dark Tower: Eddie and Susannah!

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Matt: of course everyone expresses only his/her own opinion, whose else? When posted, however, it will necessariily become subject of discussion, which ensues from the very nature of forums.

Matt
07-24-2007, 06:56 AM
I totally understand that Jean, I think we are in the same place again.

For the record, I post my opinion in an effort to discuss it, not the opposite as I assume we all do. :couple:

Letti
07-24-2007, 11:02 AM
Cry your pardon Jean but what do you mean by "it's easy to die when you're young"???

ZoNeSeeK
07-24-2007, 09:04 PM
To me it indicates the constant influence King's own relationship with Tabitha has on everything he does - it always finds a way to come in some shape or form in most of his stories. As a writer it would be a resource to draw on.

Matt
07-25-2007, 07:00 AM
That's a great point. He seems very much in love with her and I believe (like all men in love) he feels like she saved him to a certain extent.

ZoNeSeeK
07-25-2007, 04:18 PM
King wrote a column in a magazine over here regarding ending great series (in light of the Harry Potter final book being released) and mentions the Dark Tower a couple of times.

I might scan it for you guys and post.

Jean
05-26-2008, 09:16 PM
it has been mentioned by Ruthful (supported by me; opposed by Sam Catoe) in another thread that sex scenes were " ineptly written" by King; if this topic was to be developed, I wish it would be here rather than where it started http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k291/mishemplushem/Facilitation/0134-bear.gif

obscurejude
05-27-2008, 05:57 AM
Insomnia is one of my favourite King books and consequently I love the relationship between Ralph and Lois in that.
Their romance isn't pivotal to the plot, but it wouldn't be the same if they were simply friends - their love lends something to the storyline, enriches it, encourages you to invest more in the characters...I guess thats the point you were making Jean?

I like the pace and feel of their relationship too - there aren't many books where senior citizens get to take the starring roles and I loved that about Insomnia. It also affected the type of love Ralph and Lois felt for each other. Even though they were still sexually attracted to each other, it wasn't frantic and solely lustful - it was more about caring and wanting to be cared for.

Definately a favourite :)

Very well said Lisa, I couldn't agree more. I was so attached to those characters. I found Lois really annoying at first, but as the story progressed I was won over whole heartedly. It was so fascinating to read about seniors falling in love. I was absolutely captivated.

obscurejude
05-27-2008, 06:03 AM
it has been mentioned by Ruthful (supported by me; opposed by Sam Catoe) in another thread that sex scenes were " ineptly written" by King; if this topic was to be developed, I wish it would be here rather than where it started http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k291/mishemplushem/Facilitation/0134-bear.gif

I think with King, this can really be debatable depending on what book is in discussion, which scene, and most importantly, how old King was at the time of the writing.

For example:

Lisey's story contained a few scenes, and I thought they were well done. King really nailed a long term marriage on the head in this story: love's secret language and the beauty of long term monogamy. The few sexual scenes were an outcropping of a well laid foundation.

Sometimes they don't makes sense, like in the Stand when Nick randomly fucks that girl in the abandoned drug store. A younger writer, a more lustful scene which had personal sexual frustration written all over it.

I thought the first time Alan and Polly "get together" in Needful Kings was well done. It wasn't cheesy, and it wasn't explicit.

That's all that comes to mind right now.

alinda
05-27-2008, 12:10 PM
I liked the story behind the telling of the Green Mile was also between two senior citizens who cared very deeply about each other.

Also favorite are some of the stranger "love stories" SK has given us like :
in Misery, and Delores Clairborn, there is not always a happy ending to his
love. How about the husband and wife in The Storm of the Century?
There were small nuances there that were unforgetable to me....like when Mike Anderson's wife Molly say to him in a whisper out side the jail...that
Linoge could have " an accident" , to me this kind of intimacy between charactures is something amazing to convey.Such a simple thing that is really rather deep between them. *shrug* there are many examples of this phenomenom in SK's writing. very subtle, very compelling.

Ka-tet
05-27-2008, 01:18 PM
To be honest, the dark tower aside i hav'nt really noticed the romace side of things in kings work, but i belive even if it isnt pivotal to the plot i enjoy to read it.

Jean
02-12-2012, 11:47 PM
bumping this thread for Merlin, who, for some unfathomable reason, seems to think that bears don't like love stories in King novels

DoctorDodge
02-13-2012, 04:06 AM
Wow...

...I've just learned that Jean actually enjoys the Back to the Future movies! *Mind blown*

As for you enjoying a good love story Jean: no, I'm not surprised about that in the slightest, considering how much we discussed how awesome the relationship of Sam and Annie is. Reading your first post, I'd have to agree that it's more interesting when it's not the focus that it's usually the most interesting. Like life itself, it's a great addition to it, but it doesn't define life, if that makes sense. A lot of my favourite fiction reflects this.

Merlin1958
02-13-2012, 01:43 PM
bumping this thread for Merlin, who, for some unfathomable reason, seems to think that bears don't like love stories in King novels

LOL 11/22/63 you obstinate Bear!!! LOL

No worries, you're "A" number one in my book!!!! LOL

blavigne
02-13-2012, 02:30 PM
Insomnia is one of my favourite King books and consequently I love the relationship between Ralph and Lois in that.
Their romance isn't pivotal to the plot, but it wouldn't be the same if they were simply friends - their love lends something to the storyline, enriches it, encourages you to invest more in the characters...I guess thats the point you were making Jean?

I like the pace and feel of their relationship too - there aren't many books where senior citizens get to take the starring roles and I loved that about Insomnia. It also affected the type of love Ralph and Lois felt for each other. Even though they were still sexually attracted to each other, it wasn't frantic and solely lustful - it was more about caring and wanting to be cared for.

Definately a favourite :)

Yes!

blavigne
02-13-2012, 02:37 PM
I loved the relationship that developed between Barbie and Julia in Under the Dome. Older, more cautious, reluctant, compelling and brought about by extraordinary circumstances. There was just something very touching about their discovering each other. I enjoyed reading this story a lot but it certainly was not crucial to the main plot. I am glad SK included it.