The Outsider - discussion and spoilers

[WeDealInLead]

I just read 120 pages in one go. I'm still not sure where all this is going, but I like it a lot more than the Hodges trilogy and especially Sleeping Beauties.

[biomieg]

I’m only on page 20 so I’m not ready to discuss anything but I have a good feeling about this book! :)

[TravelinJack]

About halfway in. Very good so far. So refreshing since Gwendy and Sleeping.

[WeDealInLead]

Done. Upper middle tier King, probably placed somewhere between top 30 and 40.

[Hunchback Jack]

I'm listening to the audiobook. I'm about 1.5 hours in. Really liking it so far.

[RichardX]

Finished. A good summer read. Middling King novel. Certainly much better than Sleeping Beauties but that isn't saying much. The plot reminded me of a decent X-Files or Kolchak the Night Stalker episode. The Dark Half meets Bill Hodges. Ending fizzled.

[CyberGhostface]

I liked it. I do think once the supernatural angle kicks in it loses steam but it was still an addictive read.

[TCCBodhi]

My kindle says I've got 10% to finish, so I'm nearly there. I'm enjoying it so far, though I still don't know what to make of it.

So would anyone consider this to be the 4th Bill Hodges book, with Holly playing a fairly prominent role. I'm leaning toward 'no' since we are removed from the location and other characters of Finders Keepers, but I could see arguments going the other way as well.

[Hunchback Jack]

Just finished it on audio. I think the first half was really strong, the third quarter was a bit saggy and the story went into a holding pattern, but then it picked up again for the finish.

Will Patton was a great narrator. I really enjoy his work on this and other King novels.

As for being the "fourth Bill Hodges novel", I don't think so. Perhaps it is the first "Holly Gibney" novel, though.

HBJ

[TCCBodhi]

I finished up. I enjoyed the read, especially since I was in a Tulsa hospital with the pneumonia while I was reading the end of it, but it's not a classic by any means. Kind of middle of the pack, and I kind of found the plot point a bit wearily derivative. I also love 'seeing' Holly again, but I'd rather read more original novels than continuations with her involved.

[Merlin1958]

My kindle says I've got 10% to finish, so I'm nearly there. I'm enjoying it so far, though I still don't know what to make of it.

So would anyone consider this to be the 4th Bill Hodges book, with Holly playing a fairly prominent role. I'm leaning toward 'no' since we are removed from the location and other characters of Finders Keepers, but I could see arguments going the other way as well.

Maybe its more of a "Holly" book than a "Hodges". I mean the character obviously resonates with, King. The agency and its legacy is retold. So, it is obviously a continuation of sorts. I wouldn't be surprised to see her in future works. So, its up to the individual reader, no?

[Kingfan24]

Thought it was overall a very weak book. The first half was pretty middle of the road suspense/horror and the second half was just plain bad. The villain is never fleshed out at all, and holly “killing” it with a sock with ball bearings is so weak. This is a supernatural being able to manipulate physical space with its mind and yet it can’t to more than walk at holly and get smacked and die? Come on.

[Ricky]

Finished it today (took a little over two weeks, which is pretty quick for a book this size for me). Overall, I thought it was just okay. I did enjoy it, but the first half could've used significant trimming. The investigation did seem to drag on for longer than necessary. But King totally pulled the rug out from under me by killing Terry. So bonus points for gutsy surprises.

I also love Holly so I was really happy to have her in this book (and for such a big chunk of it). I think she might be one of the best, developed, three-dimensional characters he's created. But speaking of characters, everyone else in comparison (maybe aside from Terry) felt a little bland to me. Realistic, but bland. I think it would've been better had the cast been trimmed a little.

The ending: thought the Marysville Hole was a cool, unique setting for the final confrontation (I was getting some serious IT vibes), but agree that it did seem to end a little quickly and the outsider didn't really seem as menacing in person as his crimes were. More curious rather than truly vile like I was building him up in my head.

Overall, I enjoyed it, thought it was a good summer read (but then again, anything would be after Sleeping Beauties), but probably not one that will go on my favorites list.

[stroppygoblin]

...This is a supernatural being able to manipulate physical space with its mind...

Really? I may have missed something here (I do tend to devour a new King book like hot pizza on the first reading, then go back 6 months later for a more leisurely meal) but I don't recall it manipulating anything other than it's own physiology. The villain is basically a shape-shifter.

[hungeus347]

...This is a supernatural being able to manipulate physical space with its mind... Really? I may have missed something here (I do tend to devour a new King book like hot pizza on the first reading, then go back 6 months later for a more leisurely meal) but I don't recall it manipulating anything other than it's own physiology. The villain is basically a shape-shifter. anh khong doi qua che sieu nhan (http://www.gunnyfire.com/)

[CyberGhostface]

What do you all think of King spoiling the heck out of the Bill Hodges trilogy here? Obviously we're all caught up but there's probably at least a few people here who don't read all his books immediately or watching the show first who will get nearly every major twist ruined for them.

[Lookwhoitis]

What do you all think of King spoiling the heck out of the Bill Hodges trilogy here? Obviously we're all caught up but there's probably at least a few people here who don't read all his books immediately or watching the show first who will get nearly every major twist ruined for them.

Count me as one of those people :D

[Merlin1958]

...This is a supernatural being able to manipulate physical space with its mind...

Really? I may have missed something here (I do tend to devour a new King book like hot pizza on the first reading, then go back 6 months later for a more leisurely meal) but I don't recall it manipulating anything other than it's own physiology. The villain is basically a shape-shifter.

Absolutely, Simon.

Though the creature did leave some sort of "active residue" in it's "Den" it was definitely a shapeshifter only IMHO

[Kingfan24]

...This is a supernatural being able to manipulate physical space with its mind...

Really? I may have missed something here (I do tend to devour a new King book like hot pizza on the first reading, then go back 6 months later for a more leisurely meal) but I don't recall it manipulating anything other than it's own physiology. The villain is basically a shape-shifter.

Absolutely, Simon.

Though the creature did leave some sort of "active residue" in it's "Den" it was definitely a shapeshifter only IMHO

It was able to move the chair from the kitchen to the living room as evidenced by the findings of the residue in the living room and on the chair. Unless I’m remembering that wrong. This is the problem with this villain. Inconsistent.

[Ricky]

Well, it kind of "projected" itself into Ralph's house (when Jeannie saw it in the chair), because it wasn't able to fully materialize due to weakness. So I think it was more that than any telekinetic abilities.

[Ben Mears]

What do you all think of King spoiling the heck out of the Bill Hodges trilogy here?

If I understand your question accurately you're implying that an author should refrain from referencing previous works in his/her current and future works to protect a small minority of readers from disappointment. I would venture to guess the thought never crossed SK's mind which is as it should be.

[RichardX]

Thought it was overall a very weak book. The first half was pretty middle of the road suspense/horror and the second half was just plain bad. The villain is never fleshed out at all, and holly “killing” it with a sock with ball bearings is so weak. This is a supernatural being able to manipulate physical space with its mind and yet it can’t to more than walk at holly and get smacked and die? Come on.

Yes, it always amuses me when the supernatural bad guy who may have been around for centuries is killed so easily. Every horror novel must have the inevitable "final confrontation." Dracula set the standard. If there is one reoccurring weakness in King's books it is the endings.

[CyberGhostface]

If I understand your question accurately you're implying that an author should refrain from referencing previous works in his/her current and future works to protect a small minority of readers from disappointment. I would venture to guess the thought never crossed SK's mind which is as it should be.

Kind of...? 'End of Watch' came out only two years ago and the show is on it's second season. It's not like referring to Carrie burning down the high school. The last Dark Tower book came out over a decade ago and people still use spoiler warnings here for that.

[webstar1000]

Loved the start but as some stated... when the supernatural element kicks in... I lost a bit of interest. King needs to get his writing back on track!

[Ben Mears]

The last Dark Tower book came out over a decade ago and people still use spoiler warnings here for that.

There is a significant difference between spoiler alerts on a message board and an author's obligation to someone who hasn't read his/her previous book that was released two years prior. SK often refers to his audience as "content reader." That implies that his committed audience reads each book upon release so it is unlikely that "spoiler" ever enters his mind. The fact that SK made it clear in interviews prior to the release of The Outsider that a familiar character was going to be featured in the book was enough of spoiler alert to anyone who was paying attention.

[CyberGhostface]

He’s said he doesn’t care about people being spoiled period because ‘it’s the journey that matters’ so that’s probably his mindset.

Regardless I have read a number of comments online from people who have been spoiled (including this thread) so it’s something that has been brought up. Even the Nocturnal Readers newsletter put out a message about it warning newcomers to be careful.

I'll also add that at this point King has been writing books longer than a number of his fans have even been alive and they would probably consider themselves 'constant readers' but still have yet to read all his work or are not reading his work in chronological order.

[MarkAngel1974]

Hi all; I'm so green in here I must look like kermit - also: first post, so I'm hoping not to break any of the rules (yes, I've read them), but there's something I desparately need to find out.

I am well over the first half of the book, but I am reading it in Dutch, and there's a translation-thingy that's been bothering me. I'll try to ask without spoiling anything.

Grace Maitland give a description of something she saw out of her window, and I really want to know what the english description is for the eyes. I know the dutch word (as it is in my dutch version of the book), and I know the dictionary translation for it, but I need to know if SK used that very same word, please.

Hope someone can help.

[craigobau]

Read The Outsider on holidays last week and found it really disappointing (perhaps not a surprise given i didn't enjoy the Bill Hodges trilogy).

It started out ok, and I liked the premise, but the introduction of the supernatural element just didn't fit for me with the story. SK can write so much better.

I'm hoping he's got this crime story stuff out of his system now with this fourth genre story and he returns now to the type of writing he does best.

[Heather19]

Just finished this. I really loved the first half of the book. I'm generally not into crime/detective type stories, and hated the Bill Hodges books. But this one started off so strong and really had me intrigued, then Holly enters and it completely went downhill for me. It seemed a bit jarring, and I really wish he had left this as a standalone book instead of bringing her into it. It just didn't work for me. And the ending was a bit too easily resolved as others have already mentioned. I was so disappointed by the time I finished it. It was definitely better than Sleeping Beauties, but I do wish the book had kept up the momentum of the first half. And I really do hope that King is done with these types of stories. I have no desire to read any more of them.

[WeDealInLead]

Yeah, Holly's entrance is when the book goes downhill.

[amd013]

Hi all; I'm so green in here I must look like kermit - also: first post, so I'm hoping not to break any of the rules (yes, I've read them), but there's something I desparately need to find out.

I am well over the first half of the book, but I am reading it in Dutch, and there's a translation-thingy that's been bothering me. I'll try to ask without spoiling anything.

Grace Maitland give a description of something she saw out of her window, and I really want to know what the english description is for the eyes. I know the dutch word (as it is in my dutch version of the book), and I know the dictionary translation for it, but I need to know if SK used that very same word, please.

Hope someone can help.

If I remember correctly she used the word "straw".

[amd013]

Just finished it a couple of days ago, and agree with most comments.


Liked the begining but it the investigation dragged and could have been trimmed
Thought the inclusion of Holly was unnecessary
Really hate how easy it is for the heroes to figure out all the need to about the villion based on very little evidence
Ending very anti-climatic and outsider seemed pathetic in person
annoyed by the Jack Hopkins (?? is that right name) character


It started out so well, but ends up in the top of the bottom half of his work.

Regarding spoilers, I don't think it would have hurt for SK or the publishers from putting in a warning at the beginning that it might spoil the Bill Hodges books if read out of order.

[Brian861]

I didn't really get the whole van stealing kid thing unless it was used to explain how the van got from Ohio to Texas. Which, now that I think about it, makes sense. I was really hoping the kid was the supernatural being. Agree the ending was super weak.

[St. Troy]

Re: the outsider's seemingly simple defeat: it was stated multiple times that he/it wasn't used to being identified and pursued and was in a weakened state. I agree that King has a problem with paper villains ("fushing feef," anyone?) but I don't consider this such a case.